Another dead K series engine ?

[planenut]

Originally Posted by rockerbox

The new gasket (viton) should be here by now, I was looking at installing it on the weekend.
But today I topped up coolant bottle and started car. Lots of white from the exhaust, quite a cloud to be honest, worst I've seen it. Warmed the car up for a minute or two and got slightly less smoke/vapour. Smelt exhaust, it doesn't stink of burnt oil but neither does it seem to be clean steam. Slight puddle under exhaust outlet seemed to be just coolant. Checked dip stick in case it has been burning oil, dip stick showed much mayo... uh ohh
So now I still don't know, will a failed inlet manifold gasket allow an oil water mix ? Should I continue ? or maybe accept I would need the HG done professionally ?
Advice please, I've spent a few quid on this car, although a lowly 1.8 n/a ZTT I have put in real walnut dash and trimmings, stainless T piece, new tyres, air-con fixed, hoses, new radiator, water pump, belts and so on. So sad because wifey needs a new car too after some numb nut hit and run hers.

Thanks guys and seasonal salutations !

So you are waiting for an inlet manifold gasket that you have ordered.

How about doing that, then re-assess, I feel pretty certain that the suggested solution will be the cheapest option too.

[T-Cut]

Unfortunately, a leaking IMG doesn't allow coolant into the sump, only into the cylinders (No.1 and/or 4). The compression results suggest to me that there's a coolant to oil channel failure, rather than classic HG fire ring errosion. This inter-channel type of HGF is quite common in the 1.8s. I'd certainly go ahead with a new HG. I'd fit the latest elastomer type myself so the liner heights are less important. DMGRS shop will tell you what you need.

TC

[rockerbox]

Well, tbh the liner heights were only checked with the finger nail method, I could tell they were very slightly raised from head surface but made no true engineering measurement. I did note that they rotated quite easily in their bores but the original MGR service manual said that was normal.

I'm going to replace the IMG and flush all out and see what happens, but my gut feeling is that TCut is right. I won't be doing the HG on it again, it's not economically viable to me.

Thanks for all your help.

[Avulon]

Originally Posted by T-Cut

Unfortunately, a leaking IMG doesn't allow coolant into the sump, only into the cylinders (No.1 and/or 4).

TC

And water sat on top of a piston for a time will find it's way past the piston rings into the sump.

Originally Posted by rockerbox

Well, tbh the liner heights were only checked with the finger nail method, I could tell they were very slightly raised from head surface but made no true engineering measurement. I did note that they rotated quite easily in their bores but the original MGR service manual said that was normal.

I'm going to replace the IMG and flush all out and see what happens, but my gut feeling is that TCut is right. I won't be doing the HG on it again, it's not economically viable to me.

Thanks for all your help.

Everything I've seen and read suggests ensuring that the cylinder liners don't get disturbed with the head off - movement would break the seal at the liner base allowing coolant directly into the sump!

[minimutly]

Jeez, This defies belief, if the liners are turned they will leak, simple. So your head gasket replacement was a waste of time. Once disturbed you HAVE to remove and reseal the liner. Actually not as difficult as it sounds, sump off, big ends removed, up she comes. clean, reseal and refit.
Another k series killed..

[rockerbox]

Originally Posted by minimutly

Jeez, This defies belief, if the liners are turned they will leak, simple. So your head gasket replacement was a waste of time. Once disturbed you HAVE to remove and reseal the liner. Actually not as difficult as it sounds, sump off, big ends removed, up she comes. clean, reseal and refit.
Another k series killed..

Yes, I have heard this said before, but there are those don't agree as long as the liner isn't lifted. In fact while replacing the head gasket I asked several times for advice which was kindly forthcoming. One post gave me an official Rover workshop manual including the section regarding the liners. There, Rover state rotation of the liners does not cause a problem (naturally I didn't freely spin them, just noticed they turned slightly when going about polishing up the block face). Of course you may be entirely right that there lies a problem and it's a job I could handle, but I wont be as instantly convinced as you seem to be.

Thanks all for keeping up with this, I'm still waiting for Rimmers to deliver the IMG so I can try it. Will update as soon as I have it replaced.

[minimutly]

If you imagine a cast iron tube, sitting on a machines aluminium ledge, with some hylomar applied at the factory. How can it not leak?

[Avulon]

keeping my fingers crossed for you that it is only the IMG.

[marinabrian]

Originally Posted by minimutly

If you imagine a cast iron tube, sitting on a machines aluminium ledge, with some hylomar applied at the factory. How can it not leak?

I'm sorry to say I completely concur with this statement, and the water in the oil is likely to have come from the jacket spaces around the liners leaking into the sump via the base of the liners.

A bit of confusion abounds here, and the OP has been referred to the K series manual reference to the early damp liner engine, however all that said and done it will not be the IMG, and you will need to remove the sump and head to remove the pistons and liners to reseal the liner to block joints.

As an aside, why did you rotate the liners in the first instance? it is fairly important if liners are removed that they are refitted in the exact orientation that they were removed, normally by using a permanent felt tip marker to put a reference mark on the block and liner top.

It will have been a learning curve for you, and serve as a reminder to not do it again

Don't worry, if nothing else it will allow you to give the sump a good clean out

Brian