Another dead K series engine ?

rockerbox · 27th November 2016, 17:09

Brief history, I changed the HG about 1 year, couple of thousand miles ago. Used the MLS one after head skimmed. Had a couple of hoses blow since causing overheat (by gauge and red light), always managed to stop car immediately and repair.
Latest issue was rough idle (at lights etc) but only once car was up to running temp, from cold it started and ran well. This was accompanied by orange flashing engine management light which stopped after getting going over about 20MPH for a minute or two. Car feels normal at any cruising speed. Examined all leads, plugs, coil packs, and started engine without each pot firing one by one, every time the engine ran worse, so it's not a constant not firing on one (though diagnostic tool did say misfire on 2)
So had another hose go, small bleed hose from back of engine and top of rad to exp' bottle Replaced this hose with MGR new one, proper hose clips et al. Also replaced exp' bottle cap with new 140 one.
Recently still getting coolant loss, quite a bit, litre or so each trip, and, crucially, it seems to me, an excessive amount of water vapour from exhaust. I'm not really sure how much vapour (steam if you like) I should expect now the days are so wet and cold and I haven't trusted it to take a good run, enough to maybe drive all condensation out, but it seems to me this is where coolant is going.
Compression test shows all cylinders within 1 bar of each other (14 bar), I checked to see if it was an obvious breach of gasket or fouled valve, whatever.
So I'm wondering if this sounds like an obvious death knell for the ZTT or could I be looking at other things ? like maybe water getting into firing mixture somewhere at the inlet maybe. Finding my knowledge is coming to it's limit now.
Thanks people.

1800 n/a petrol

suzublu · 27th November 2016, 17:18

Sounds very much like inlet manifold gasket leak.

kc13661 · 27th November 2016, 17:25

Curious, when the Head gasket was replaced was the system fully flushed out, if so how many times, sounds like there could be 'gunge' in the system and causing blockages, this in turn would clog pipes causing them to blow

Number 6 · 27th November 2016, 17:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by suzublu

Sounds very much like inlet manifold gasket leak.

rockerbox · 27th November 2016, 17:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by kc13661

Curious, when the Head gasket was replaced was the system fully flushed out, if so how many times, sounds like there could be 'gunge' in the system and causing blockages, this in turn would clog pipes causing them to blow

The system was flushed a couple of times, I no doubt could have been more thorough. The sump pan was also replaced due to damage so all the goo collected there has gone. Blown hoses showed no sign of mayo.

Quote:

Originally Posted by suzublu

Sounds very much like inlet manifold gasket leak.

Ok, great, this is excellent news and a confirmed diagnosis I see. Nice I didn't see the automatic HGF message.

Will order a new gasket for inlet tomorrow, any particular are preferred ?

Sheraton · 27th November 2016, 19:52

I'm sure there's an upgraded viton gasket available for the 1.8 k series.

or do as i'm doing and others have done - replace complete manifold with an aluminium VVC part

Paul.

rockerbox · 28th November 2016, 08:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sheraton

I'm sure there's an upgraded viton gasket available for the 1.8 k series.

or do as i'm doing and others have done - replace complete manifold with an aluminium VVC part

Paul.

Thanks Paul. Think I will try just the viton gasket for now before I invest in new manifold. If it proves the inlet gasket is the problem then I will look at upgrading to the ally part.

At least this gives me an opportunity to be able to get to the two bolts under the idle control valve which I can't get any tork tool I have in

and give that a service.

rockerbox · 1st December 2016, 18:17

The new gasket (viton) should be here by now, I was looking at installing it on the weekend.
But today I topped up coolant bottle and started car. Lots of white from the exhaust, quite a cloud to be honest, worst I've seen it. Warmed the car up for a minute or two and got slightly less smoke/vapour. Smelt exhaust, it doesn't stink of burnt oil but neither does it seem to be clean steam. Slight puddle under exhaust outlet seemed to be just coolant. Checked dip stick in case it has been burning oil, dip stick showed much mayo... uh ohh

So now I still don't know, will a failed inlet manifold gasket allow an oil water mix ? Should I continue ? or maybe accept I would need the HG done professionally ?
Advice please, I've spent a few quid on this car, although a lowly 1.8 n/a ZTT I have put in real walnut dash and trimmings, stainless T piece, new tyres, air-con fixed, hoses, new radiator, water pump, belts and so on. So sad because wifey needs a new car too after some numb nut hit and run hers.

Thanks guys and seasonal salutations !

rockerbox · 2nd December 2016, 08:37

Maybe there is a forum user in the Thurrock -Essex/Kent/E London area that would be able to have a look at my car for me ?

I don't want to scrap it or even do an HG replacement without an authorative diagnosis of HGF like I've heard so often happens.

roverbarmy · 2nd December 2016, 09:17

When you changed the head gasket, did you check the heights of the liners? If so, were they all even? It affects the decision as to which gasket to use.

27th November 2016, 17:09	#1
rockerbox Avid contributor MG ZT/T Join Date: Dec 2015 Location: Thurrock Posts: 244 Thanks: 37 Thanked 39 Times in 34 Posts	Another dead K series engine ? Brief history, I changed the HG about 1 year, couple of thousand miles ago. Used the MLS one after head skimmed. Had a couple of hoses blow since causing overheat (by gauge and red light), always managed to stop car immediately and repair. Latest issue was rough idle (at lights etc) but only once car was up to running temp, from cold it started and ran well. This was accompanied by orange flashing engine management light which stopped after getting going over about 20MPH for a minute or two. Car feels normal at any cruising speed. Examined all leads, plugs, coil packs, and started engine without each pot firing one by one, every time the engine ran worse, so it's not a constant not firing on one (though diagnostic tool did say misfire on 2) So had another hose go, small bleed hose from back of engine and top of rad to exp' bottle Replaced this hose with MGR new one, proper hose clips et al. Also replaced exp' bottle cap with new 140 one. Recently still getting coolant loss, quite a bit, litre or so each trip, and, crucially, it seems to me, an excessive amount of water vapour from exhaust. I'm not really sure how much vapour (steam if you like) I should expect now the days are so wet and cold and I haven't trusted it to take a good run, enough to maybe drive all condensation out, but it seems to me this is where coolant is going. Compression test shows all cylinders within 1 bar of each other (14 bar), I checked to see if it was an obvious breach of gasket or fouled valve, whatever. So I'm wondering if this sounds like an obvious death knell for the ZTT or could I be looking at other things ? like maybe water getting into firing mixture somewhere at the inlet maybe. Finding my knowledge is coming to it's limit now. Thanks people. 1800 n/a petrol Last edited by rockerbox; 27th November 2016 at 17:15.. Reason: add engine info

27th November 2016, 17:25	#3
kc13661 I really should get out more....... Freelander Td4 Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Gateshead Posts: 2,332 Thanks: 704 Thanked 909 Times in 419 Posts	Curious, when the Head gasket was replaced was the system fully flushed out, if so how many times, sounds like there could be 'gunge' in the system and causing blockages, this in turn would clog pipes causing them to blow __________________ ------------------------------------------------------------------- Growing old is compulsory.... Growing up is Optional

1st December 2016, 18:17	#8
rockerbox Avid contributor MG ZT/T Join Date: Dec 2015 Location: Thurrock Posts: 244 Thanks: 37 Thanked 39 Times in 34 Posts	worse than I thought? The new gasket (viton) should be here by now, I was looking at installing it on the weekend. But today I topped up coolant bottle and started car. Lots of white from the exhaust, quite a cloud to be honest, worst I've seen it. Warmed the car up for a minute or two and got slightly less smoke/vapour. Smelt exhaust, it doesn't stink of burnt oil but neither does it seem to be clean steam. Slight puddle under exhaust outlet seemed to be just coolant. Checked dip stick in case it has been burning oil, dip stick showed much mayo... uh ohh So now I still don't know, will a failed inlet manifold gasket allow an oil water mix ? Should I continue ? or maybe accept I would need the HG done professionally ? Advice please, I've spent a few quid on this car, although a lowly 1.8 n/a ZTT I have put in real walnut dash and trimmings, stainless T piece, new tyres, air-con fixed, hoses, new radiator, water pump, belts and so on. So sad because wifey needs a new car too after some numb nut hit and run hers. Thanks guys and seasonal salutations !

2nd December 2016, 09:17	#10
roverbarmy This is my second home Roverless + 1.7D Sportage Join Date: Aug 2014 Location: East Norfolk Posts: 7,050 Thanks: 729 Thanked 2,021 Times in 1,449 Posts	When you changed the head gasket, did you check the heights of the liners? If so, were they all even? It affects the decision as to which gasket to use. __________________ Oil in my veins!

27th November 2016, 17:18	#2
suzublu This is my second home rover 75 1.8 vvc club se wedgwood blue Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Seaton Carew Posts: 26,912 Thanks: 65 Thanked 7,142 Times in 4,642 Posts	Sounds very much like inlet manifold gasket leak.

27th November 2016, 19:52	#6
Sheraton Posted a thing or two Rover 75 1.8t Join Date: Oct 2015 Location: Edinburgh Posts: 1,377 Thanks: 384 Thanked 409 Times in 267 Posts	I'm sure there's an upgraded viton gasket available for the 1.8 k series. or do as i'm doing and others have done - replace complete manifold with an aluminium VVC part Paul.

2nd December 2016, 08:37	#9
rockerbox Avid contributor MG ZT/T Join Date: Dec 2015 Location: Thurrock Posts: 244 Thanks: 37 Thanked 39 Times in 34 Posts	Maybe there is a forum user in the Thurrock -Essex/Kent/E London area that would be able to have a look at my car for me ? I don't want to scrap it or even do an HG replacement without an authorative diagnosis of HGF like I've heard so often happens.