Diesel Smoke Reduction - A Cure??

Roverron · 18th December 2006, 09:48

Check out MGoracle's thread on the .org forum.

It could be the reason why some diesels smoke more than other when tuned.

Certainly sounds like it could be another small but effective tweak!

http://forums.mg-rover.org/showthrea...39#post1759939

Ron

Keith · 18th December 2006, 10:52

Oooooooo thanks Ron that is one to investigate

M47Rman · 18th December 2006, 10:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roverron

Check out MGoracle's thread on the .org forum.

It could be the reason why some diesels smoke more than other when tuned.

Certainly sounds like it could be another small but effective tweak!

http://forums.mg-rover.org/showthrea...39#post1759939

Ron

It is all in the dim and distant past now, but the parts which you are referring to, I think are the positive crankcase ventilation valve (PCV) and the breather filter. As far as I can remember, you should have both. One is a plastic valve, the other is a woolen type filter. Both are an integral part of the engine breather system, and their job is to remove oil entrained in the engine breather gases, and return it to the sump. If memory serves me correct, there is a drain leg down through the head and block, to return the oil to the sump. Changing the woolen type filter could improve the engines breather system performance, particularly on high mileage engines, but the PCV valve normally only needs changing if it is faulty. We did on occasions change the woolen filter on test bed engines, although I don't ever recall doing the same on any in vehicle engines. If the breather system is not removing the oil effectively, then clearly your tailpipe emissions will increase, due to the burning off of the oil.:lol:
Andy

pondweed · 18th December 2006, 11:40

so is it this bit?
(formerly STC4733A)
LLJ000060
Valve assembly-depression control
£33 quid-odd

would it be possible to get the woollen filter separately.. nothing seemingly listed?

M47Rman · 18th December 2006, 12:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by pondweed

so is it this bit?
(formerly STC4733A)
LLJ000060
Valve assembly-depression control
£33 quid-odd

would it be possible to get the woollen filter separately.. nothing seemingly listed?

The woolen filters certainly came to us seperately, but that was direct from BMW. Trouble is, I don't think BMW list it as a service item, so not sure how you would go about getting one. Valve assembly - depression control sounds about right for a BMW description of the item. They always did like saying things in a roundabout way!
Andy

pondweed · 18th December 2006, 16:26

I should have clarified that the part number/price above is from the Xpart MGR list...

M47Rman · 18th December 2006, 17:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by pondweed

I should have clarified that the part number/price above is from the Xpart MGR list...

Undoubtedly, but all the part descriptions given to Rover service department, and other publication departments, were supplied by Rovers Diesel department, and were in turn given to us direct from ..........BMW.

Paranoid Carlos · 18th December 2006, 19:15

What sort of stripdown is required to this.....I looked at this valve a few months ago, I thought I saw some strange headed bolts (male torx) that I couldn't undo...........Could explain my oily smokey smell when ticking over ?

And also the smoke problem when I first had the car............plumes of smoke when lifting off that gradually cleared over a few weeks.

M47Rman · 18th December 2006, 19:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by paranoid

What sort of stripdown is required to this.....I looked at this valve a few months ago, I thought I saw some strange headed bolts (male torx) that I couldn't undo...........Could explain my oily smokey smell when ticking over ?

And also the smoke problem when I first had the car............plumes of smoke when lifting off that gradually cleared over a few weeks.

It certainly could explain an overrun smoke problem, although that can also be caused by worn valve stem oil seals as I recall. Not likely on yours though, as the problem has cleared, so could well be a breather issue. I believe you are correct that the valve is secured with torx screws. I do not recall our test bed guys having any problems changing parts on the breather system, so once you have a bit to fit the screws it should not be a problem to get the valve out.
Another potential cause of smoke from the diesels is a catalyst storage problem. We had this issue initially on L series in Rover 600. What happens is that during lots of light throttle, steady state driving, the oil being burnt by the engine (due to entrainment in the breather gases) is not fully burnt off, and ends up deposited in the exhaust catalyst. During steady state driving, the cat temperature remains relatively low, and the unburnt oil in the cat steadily builds up. After an extended period of this type of driving, when the engine suddenly sees a full load situation (for example full throttle overtaking or driving up a steep hill), the exhaust temperature, and therefore cat temperature spikes upwards, and lights the cat up, which instantly burns off the oil build up in the cat, and leads to great clouds of blue/grey/black smoke!
This could also have been part of your problem! It was a significant problem on R600 and is very difficult to stop.
I will have to try and dig out some of my old M47 files from the back of the shed - until recently (after joining the club) I had not even thought about M47 for about 5 years!

Andy

Paranoid Carlos · 18th December 2006, 20:02

M47 Man where were you a year ago, When everywhere I went it was new engine new turbo minimum of £2000 plus labour!!!!!!
I was a apprentice trained mechanic for ten years and it just didn't seem likely after 80'000 for it to be valve seals, but after just buying the car I was in a bit of a panic!!

I knew all along it wasn't an engine failure as such, but at first it seemed like a blown turbo but there wasn't really a pattern. Now I get a puff of blueish white smoke every 100th start nothing much to see at all. When I first got the car if the car sat idleing for a couple of minutes and you drove off the first time you lifted off really couldn't see the car behind, I changed the Air filter as it was solid, this helped obviously, but seemed to go worse after I changed the oil and put the oil in too quick (I squeezed the bottle ) I presumed this filled the rocker area up, after another oil change a couple of months later (just to get things cleaned up, see if more crud came out) smoke was nearly down to nothing, at the moment it hasn't belched for at least a month

18th December 2006, 09:48	#1
Roverron Gets stuck in Rover Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Tarbert Posts: 980 Thanks: 0 Thanked 19 Times in 9 Posts	Diesel Smoke Reduction - A Cure?? Check out MGoracle's thread on the .org forum. It could be the reason why some diesels smoke more than other when tuned. Certainly sounds like it could be another small but effective tweak! http://forums.mg-rover.org/showthrea...39#post1759939 Ron __________________ [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] Click to visit my website Ron on Twitter MyFacebook page

18th December 2006, 20:02	#10
Paranoid Carlos Posted a thing or two Starlight CDT Conn SE Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Erdington, Birmingham Posts: 1,057 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	M47 Man where were you a year ago, When everywhere I went it was new engine new turbo minimum of £2000 plus labour!!!!!! I was a apprentice trained mechanic for ten years and it just didn't seem likely after 80'000 for it to be valve seals, but after just buying the car I was in a bit of a panic!! I knew all along it wasn't an engine failure as such, but at first it seemed like a blown turbo but there wasn't really a pattern. Now I get a puff of blueish white smoke every 100th start nothing much to see at all. When I first got the car if the car sat idleing for a couple of minutes and you drove off the first time you lifted off really couldn't see the car behind, I changed the Air filter as it was solid, this helped obviously, but seemed to go worse after I changed the oil and put the oil in too quick (I squeezed the bottle ) I presumed this filled the rocker area up, after another oil change a couple of months later (just to get things cleaned up, see if more crud came out) smoke was nearly down to nothing, at the moment it hasn't belched for at least a month Last edited by Paranoid Carlos; 18th December 2006 at 20:05..

18th December 2006, 10:52	#2
Keith This is my second home ZT400 Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Ellesmere Posts: 5,948 Thanks: 0 Thanked 43 Times in 29 Posts	Oooooooo thanks Ron that is one to investigate

18th December 2006, 11:40	#4
pondweed This is my second home Waiter, Waiter! I seem to have a Roomster in my drive... Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Sussex Posts: 3,268 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	so is it this bit? (formerly STC4733A) LLJ000060 Valve assembly-depression control £33 quid-odd would it be possible to get the woollen filter separately.. nothing seemingly listed?

18th December 2006, 16:26	#6
pondweed This is my second home Waiter, Waiter! I seem to have a Roomster in my drive... Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Sussex Posts: 3,268 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	I should have clarified that the part number/price above is from the Xpart MGR list...

18th December 2006, 19:15	#8
Paranoid Carlos Posted a thing or two Starlight CDT Conn SE Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Erdington, Birmingham Posts: 1,057 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	What sort of stripdown is required to this.....I looked at this valve a few months ago, I thought I saw some strange headed bolts (male torx) that I couldn't undo...........Could explain my oily smokey smell when ticking over ? And also the smoke problem when I first had the car............plumes of smoke when lifting off that gradually cleared over a few weeks.