Weird temperture behaviour 2.5 v6 - Page 14

Pruts3r · 21st August 2017, 22:44

My camshaft didnt realy break. The end of it where the big belt wheel goes into it got torn by the cambelt wheel. You can really see that the wheel was being forced by the belt to keep turning and digging into the camshaft slot

kaiser · 22nd August 2017, 06:21

If the camshaft has been binding, there must have been (or be) a problem with the oil supply, at least to the cam bearing in front of the break.

I am not sure if that can happen without leaving traces on the cam belt, so maybe have a careful look at that too.?

Pruts3r · 26th August 2017, 19:18

Removed the oil sump and we got quite a shock. The sump had about 2cm of sludge with chunks like porridge in it. Looks like the previous owners skipped not just 1 or 2 oil changes. The sieve was totally blocked too. We now totally cleaned the sieve and the sump. This may have caused the freezing of the camshaft we think.

kaiser · 27th August 2017, 16:54

Which immediately poses the question, why did your oil pressure warning light not come on?

I would check the light and the sensor.

Further remove all spark plugs and run on starter when rebuilt, until the oil pressure is there.

Most likely not necessary, but a sound precaution.

Bolin · 27th August 2017, 18:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by kaiser

Which immediately poses the question, why did your oil pressure warning light not come on?

The sensor is on the oil pump, and the rear bank didn't have the failure - so perhaps the problem was solely in the oil-way going up to the front bank.

Putting the sensor right by the oil pump doesn't seem so sensible to me, perhaps it would have been better to have two sensors in the parts of the lubrication circuit furthest away from the pump i.e. in both cylinder heads

kaiser · 27th August 2017, 18:26

No that makes sense, as it is a warning to see if the pump has pressure on the delivery side.
In case of loss of oil pressure, you will get the quickest warning close to the pump.

If the pump suction from the pick-up in the sump has been blocked, the light should be on.

Does the computer shut the engine off in case of oil pressure failure?

Pruts3r · 28th August 2017, 09:16

We tester oil pressure by cranking the engine on the starter with the cam covers NOT in place (and al the spark plugs removed of course)
A steady oil flow was seen right away after cleaning the sieve and sump. Everything got lubricated good.

Also when topping up the oil before that we choose to pour it direct trough the holes in to the engine (no, not the holes were the spark plugs go ��) instead of just topping up via the oil cap. This so that oil gets quicker around in the dried up engine.

Engine runs much much smoother than ever. Before it always had a tappety and slight knocking noise. We thought the VIS unit was getting to its end. As it now turns out we were hearing the camshafts running with almost no oil...

Oil pressure light pops of much faster now and stays of longer before coming on again when switched engine off.

Had a 16km test drive and drove like a dream...again.

Why didn't oil pressure light come on? Well the bottom of the engine had plenty of oil. The pump most likely had to suck like a cheerleader but failed to get out enough to supply the top part of the heads with enough oil while the bottom got plenty

Does al this make sense to you guys?

Oh and besides temp readout trick on the display inside is there also an oil pressure readout possible the same way?

SD1too · 28th August 2017, 10:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pruts3r

... is there also an oil pressure readout possible the same way?

No, because the KV6 only has an oil pressure switch. The official method for measuring oil pressure is to remove the switch and fit a dial gauge. Data is provided for idle and 3,000 rpm.

What did you do about the damaged camshaft end?

Simon

Pruts3r · 28th August 2017, 11:05

We THINK oil supply to front cam was very little and the cranking AA did trying to start it may have starved it and gave the final nudge. Camshaft got to hot. And seazed up when cooled down. When we applied the starter the next morning die timing belt tried to turn everything around on the starter motor and that tore up the camshaft end...

Something like that...

I got lucky with a very nice replacement head from a 2004 car with very low mileage on it. Head looked like new without being cleaned. Swapped the complete head. First had its surface done and took it apart and cleaned it al.

Bolin · 28th August 2017, 22:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pruts3r

Why didn't oil pressure light come on? Well the bottom of the engine had plenty of oil. The pump most likely had to suck like a cheerleader but failed to get out enough to supply the top part of the heads with enough oil while the bottom got plenty

Just one point - the supply to the rear bank is the one furthest from the oil pump. So it seems odd that if it was an overall problem with supplying the top of the engine that the front head had the failure and not the rear. Hence I suggested that blockage may have occurred in the oil-way that serves the front head, after it splits from the oil-way going to the rear head.

But sounds like it is all sorted now

21st August 2017, 22:44	#131
Pruts3r Avid contributor 1999 Rover 75 Sterling - Pewter Grey - Aubergine Leather & 1985 Rover 3500 Vitesse - Targa Red Join Date: Aug 2016 Location: Rotterdam Posts: 122 Thanks: 40 Thanked 19 Times in 13 Posts	My camshaft didnt realy break. The end of it where the big belt wheel goes into it got torn by the cambelt wheel. You can really see that the wheel was being forced by the belt to keep turning and digging into the camshaft slot __________________ '99 Rover 75 sterling 2.5 auto in Pewter grey with Aubergine interior •Born on Wednesday the 23rd of June 1999 @ 11:35:32 •The 6367th 75 to be produced. •The 214th Pewter Grey 75 out of 442. •Probably one of a handful Pewters with Aubergine.

22nd August 2017, 06:21	#132
kaiser This is my second home 75 Tourer 2.5 Auto, 1.8T, 75V8ZT Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Johannesburg ZA Posts: 6,200 Thanks: 1 Thanked 859 Times in 613 Posts	If the camshaft has been binding, there must have been (or be) a problem with the oil supply, at least to the cam bearing in front of the break. I am not sure if that can happen without leaving traces on the cam belt, so maybe have a careful look at that too.? __________________ Worth his V8 in gold

26th August 2017, 19:18	#133
Pruts3r Avid contributor 1999 Rover 75 Sterling - Pewter Grey - Aubergine Leather & 1985 Rover 3500 Vitesse - Targa Red Join Date: Aug 2016 Location: Rotterdam Posts: 122 Thanks: 40 Thanked 19 Times in 13 Posts	Removed the oil sump and we got quite a shock. The sump had about 2cm of sludge with chunks like porridge in it. Looks like the previous owners skipped not just 1 or 2 oil changes. The sieve was totally blocked too. We now totally cleaned the sieve and the sump. This may have caused the freezing of the camshaft we think. __________________ '99 Rover 75 sterling 2.5 auto in Pewter grey with Aubergine interior •Born on Wednesday the 23rd of June 1999 @ 11:35:32 •The 6367th 75 to be produced. •The 214th Pewter Grey 75 out of 442. •Probably one of a handful Pewters with Aubergine.

27th August 2017, 16:54	#134
kaiser This is my second home 75 Tourer 2.5 Auto, 1.8T, 75V8ZT Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Johannesburg ZA Posts: 6,200 Thanks: 1 Thanked 859 Times in 613 Posts	Which immediately poses the question, why did your oil pressure warning light not come on? I would check the light and the sensor. Further remove all spark plugs and run on starter when rebuilt, until the oil pressure is there. Most likely not necessary, but a sound precaution. __________________ Worth his V8 in gold

27th August 2017, 18:26	#136
kaiser This is my second home 75 Tourer 2.5 Auto, 1.8T, 75V8ZT Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Johannesburg ZA Posts: 6,200 Thanks: 1 Thanked 859 Times in 613 Posts	No that makes sense, as it is a warning to see if the pump has pressure on the delivery side. In case of loss of oil pressure, you will get the quickest warning close to the pump. If the pump suction from the pick-up in the sump has been blocked, the light should be on. Does the computer shut the engine off in case of oil pressure failure? __________________ Worth his V8 in gold

28th August 2017, 09:16	#137
Pruts3r Avid contributor 1999 Rover 75 Sterling - Pewter Grey - Aubergine Leather & 1985 Rover 3500 Vitesse - Targa Red Join Date: Aug 2016 Location: Rotterdam Posts: 122 Thanks: 40 Thanked 19 Times in 13 Posts	We tester oil pressure by cranking the engine on the starter with the cam covers NOT in place (and al the spark plugs removed of course) A steady oil flow was seen right away after cleaning the sieve and sump. Everything got lubricated good. Also when topping up the oil before that we choose to pour it direct trough the holes in to the engine (no, not the holes were the spark plugs go ��) instead of just topping up via the oil cap. This so that oil gets quicker around in the dried up engine. Engine runs much much smoother than ever. Before it always had a tappety and slight knocking noise. We thought the VIS unit was getting to its end. As it now turns out we were hearing the camshafts running with almost no oil... Oil pressure light pops of much faster now and stays of longer before coming on again when switched engine off. Had a 16km test drive and drove like a dream...again. Why didn't oil pressure light come on? Well the bottom of the engine had plenty of oil. The pump most likely had to suck like a cheerleader but failed to get out enough to supply the top part of the heads with enough oil while the bottom got plenty Does al this make sense to you guys? Oh and besides temp readout trick on the display inside is there also an oil pressure readout possible the same way? __________________ '99 Rover 75 sterling 2.5 auto in Pewter grey with Aubergine interior •Born on Wednesday the 23rd of June 1999 @ 11:35:32 •The 6367th 75 to be produced. •The 214th Pewter Grey 75 out of 442. •Probably one of a handful Pewters with Aubergine. Last edited by Pruts3r; 28th August 2017 at 09:25..

28th August 2017, 11:05	#139
Pruts3r Avid contributor 1999 Rover 75 Sterling - Pewter Grey - Aubergine Leather & 1985 Rover 3500 Vitesse - Targa Red Join Date: Aug 2016 Location: Rotterdam Posts: 122 Thanks: 40 Thanked 19 Times in 13 Posts	We THINK oil supply to front cam was very little and the cranking AA did trying to start it may have starved it and gave the final nudge. Camshaft got to hot. And seazed up when cooled down. When we applied the starter the next morning die timing belt tried to turn everything around on the starter motor and that tore up the camshaft end... Something like that... I got lucky with a very nice replacement head from a 2004 car with very low mileage on it. Head looked like new without being cleaned. Swapped the complete head. First had its surface done and took it apart and cleaned it al. __________________ '99 Rover 75 sterling 2.5 auto in Pewter grey with Aubergine interior •Born on Wednesday the 23rd of June 1999 @ 11:35:32 •The 6367th 75 to be produced. •The 214th Pewter Grey 75 out of 442. •Probably one of a handful Pewters with Aubergine. Last edited by Pruts3r; 28th August 2017 at 15:09..