cdt diesel starting problems

bennyhill · 10th January 2011, 10:19

right where shall i start, i purchased a rover 75 cdt with 82000 mile on the clock a couple of months ago and noticed that every so often it was a pig to start when it did start it ran fine,but if i used it for a short journey, then tried to restart it, it took ages,finally it wouldnt start at all and i got the rac man out to it after carring out several tests, he could not get it it to fire up,then he squirted some easy start into the air intake and it roared into life, he suspected that the fuel pressure sensor may be at fault.I booked the car into my local garage who carried diagnostics on the engine and concluded that the glo-plug relay was at fault,they duly changed the part,the car started "ok" ,but i wasnt convinced,any way i went to visit my daughter in glasgow at xmas and when we set off for home on boxing day had the same problem,luckily had had purchased some easy start from halfords and hey presto car started with the first turn of the key,yesterday same thing again, i am tempted to go back to the garage,but they said if the glo plug relay didnt work then i may have to get a new ecu, noticed that when i bought the car and got it homethat the towing eye was in the glove compartment.....very ominous, please, i would be very grateful for any advice

SD1too · 10th January 2011, 10:40

Hello John and

.

I'm not a diesel expert but I recall other members having a problem with the glow plug circuit. I'm sure one of them will be along shortly to help you.

As you've just bought the car, a full engine service might be worth considering.

Don't be persuaded to buy new ECUs at this stage.

Simon.

bennyhill · 10th January 2011, 10:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by SD1too

Hello John and

.

I'm not a diesel expert but I recall other members having a problem with the glow plug circuit. I'm sure one of them will be along shortly to help you.

As you've just bought the car, a full engine service might be worth considering.

Don't be persuaded to buy new ECUs at this stage.

Simon.

thanks for that, i have already had a service done when i got the car £180 !!, im not sure wether to take it back or to try some where else,does any body know of a decent diesel specialist in the hull area

Raistlin · 10th January 2011, 11:18

I noticed that you say it wouldn't start after a short journey (ie engine warm).

The first thing I would think of is the cam sensor.

simdel1 · 10th January 2011, 11:20

Sounds like it could be a cam or crank sensor. It's a fault i've seen at work where the sensor isn't reading the teeth on the cam or crank shaft correctly which results in the ECU not knowing how fast the engine is rotating or even if it's running backwards! The result is that the ECU intermittently decides to switch off the fuel circuit as and when the sensor misses a few teeth. The easy start will help because it will allow the engine to accelerate quicker from the few injections that it's getting during cranking.

If it's running fine after it starts, I would be incredibly surprised if it's the ECU that's at fault. Take the car to another garage if they push for an ECU change without checking other things. A fault code scanner isn't a substitute for proper fault finding!

wuzerk · 10th January 2011, 11:20

It will not be the fault of the glow plugs. These engines start perfectly well if in otherwise good condition without the glow plugs. The CAM SENSOR is used on start up and, if faulty is easy to replace(just in front of the oil filler cap). If it starts from cold but not when hot you can put the cam sensor in the freezer to cool it and then see if it starts. You would be extremely unlucky to need a new ECU which is about the last thing which should be considered. However, it could be suffering water damage if you have a blocked Plennum drain.
A search on here will give a great deal of advice on that subject.
Rover Rons site www.tuning-diesels.com has a lot of info on such problems and is worth a study. I don't like the sound of that garage.

trebor · 10th January 2011, 12:03

exactly same symptoms i had in my last diesel conny, was the cam sensor

chrissyboy · 10th January 2011, 20:49

i agree with the others that is sounds like either the camshaft sensor or the krankshaft sensors ,as it does start i would go with it being the camshaft sensor,i would aso take it back to the garage as they have clearly not sorted the fault and charged you for something that wasnt the problem and of course in their diagnotics checks they should of hooked up to the sensors to look for any bad wave forms,

stevehotshot · 11th January 2011, 18:14

i had problems with CDT difficult to start after short journeys and it was the in-tank fuel pump, as advised on this site. problem worse when low on fuel. i.e. less than 120 miles left according to computer. changed pump insert (£90ish) and fine now. (i am a relative newbie and wondered why this suggested solution hadn't come up yet, as it was one of the first things i'd picked up from using this site.) also did plenum drains as mine started cutting out after right turns, ...water splashing into ECU..
absolutely brill now...what a car!

Mike Noc · 12th January 2011, 16:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by stevehotshot

i had problems with CDT difficult to start after short journeys and it was the in-tank fuel pump, as advised on this site. problem worse when low on fuel. i.e. less than 120 miles left according to computer. changed pump insert (£90ish) and fine now. (i am a relative newbie and wondered why this suggested solution hadn't come up yet, as it was one of the first things i'd picked up from using this site.) also did plenum drains as mine started cutting out after right turns, ...water splashing into ECU..
absolutely brill now...what a car!

Reason no-one has suggested it Steve is that the symptoms don't fit the intank pump failing. Normally this causes the engine to stop or refuse to start at all when the tank level drops to below a quarter full.

If your car was difficult to start and you replaced the intank pump and all is fine then if you have an under bonnet pump that may well be worn or non OEM because the cars with these fitted will run for months with a failed intank pump, as long as there is enough diesel, despite what alot of people will tell you.

If you don't have an under the bonnet low pressure pump then your intank pump was displaying a rare type of fault for this unit.

Mike

10th January 2011, 10:19	#1
bennyhill Newbie rover 75 CONNOISSEUR Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Hull Posts: 10 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	cdt diesel starting problems right where shall i start, i purchased a rover 75 cdt with 82000 mile on the clock a couple of months ago and noticed that every so often it was a pig to start when it did start it ran fine,but if i used it for a short journey, then tried to restart it, it took ages,finally it wouldnt start at all and i got the rac man out to it after carring out several tests, he could not get it it to fire up,then he squirted some easy start into the air intake and it roared into life, he suspected that the fuel pressure sensor may be at fault.I booked the car into my local garage who carried diagnostics on the engine and concluded that the glo-plug relay was at fault,they duly changed the part,the car started "ok" ,but i wasnt convinced,any way i went to visit my daughter in glasgow at xmas and when we set off for home on boxing day had the same problem,luckily had had purchased some easy start from halfords and hey presto car started with the first turn of the key,yesterday same thing again, i am tempted to go back to the garage,but they said if the glo plug relay didnt work then i may have to get a new ecu, noticed that when i bought the car and got it homethat the towing eye was in the glove compartment.....very ominous, please, i would be very grateful for any advice

10th January 2011, 10:40	#2
SD1too Doesn't do things by halves Rover 75 2.5 Connoisseur Auto (1999) Dealer launch model. Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Former Middlesex Posts: 20,388 Thanks: 1,587 Thanked 3,749 Times in 3,181 Posts	Hello John and . I'm not a diesel expert but I recall other members having a problem with the glow plug circuit. I'm sure one of them will be along shortly to help you. As you've just bought the car, a full engine service might be worth considering. Don't be persuaded to buy new ECUs at this stage. Simon. __________________ "Whatever is rightly done, however humble, is noble." Sir Henry Royce.

10th January 2011, 11:20	#5
simdel1 Posted a thing or two Rover 75 Connoisseur SE CDTi, Porsche 944 Lux, MGF Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Stamford Posts: 1,088 Thanks: 4 Thanked 6 Times in 6 Posts	Sounds like it could be a cam or crank sensor. It's a fault i've seen at work where the sensor isn't reading the teeth on the cam or crank shaft correctly which results in the ECU not knowing how fast the engine is rotating or even if it's running backwards! The result is that the ECU intermittently decides to switch off the fuel circuit as and when the sensor misses a few teeth. The easy start will help because it will allow the engine to accelerate quicker from the few injections that it's getting during cranking. If it's running fine after it starts, I would be incredibly surprised if it's the ECU that's at fault. Take the car to another garage if they push for an ECU change without checking other things. A fault code scanner isn't a substitute for proper fault finding! __________________ Simon The Simdel1 Fleet: http://img593.imageshack.us/img593/447/sigmgf.png

10th January 2011, 11:20	#6
wuzerk Passed Away Rover 75 CDT 03 auto Conn. SE Join Date: May 2009 Location: London Posts: 2,885 Thanks: 104 Thanked 254 Times in 204 Posts	Diesel non start It will not be the fault of the glow plugs. These engines start perfectly well if in otherwise good condition without the glow plugs. The CAM SENSOR is used on start up and, if faulty is easy to replace(just in front of the oil filler cap). If it starts from cold but not when hot you can put the cam sensor in the freezer to cool it and then see if it starts. You would be extremely unlucky to need a new ECU which is about the last thing which should be considered. However, it could be suffering water damage if you have a blocked Plennum drain. A search on here will give a great deal of advice on that subject. Rover Rons site www.tuning-diesels.com has a lot of info on such problems and is worth a study. I don't like the sound of that garage. Last edited by wuzerk; 10th January 2011 at 11:22..

10th January 2011, 12:03	#7
trebor This is my second home Rover 75 CDTi Connoisseur SE & MG ZT Saloon 190 Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Coven Posts: 12,523 Thanks: 526 Thanked 1,877 Times in 885 Posts	exactly same symptoms i had in my last diesel conny, was the cam sensor __________________ www.midlandsnanomeets.co.uk Robs Car Gallery Coven near Wolverhampton WV9 2000 Cowley Built Rover 75 2.0 V6 Club SE/ Atlantic Blue/ Sandstone/Walnut (daily driver) 2003 Land Rover Freelander 1 TD4 HSE Helsinki Blue/Black Leather (swmbo daily driver)

10th January 2011, 11:18	#4
Raistlin Banned 75 CDT Connoisseur SE Auto Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Wolverhampton Posts: 8,450 Thanks: 0 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts	I noticed that you say it wouldn't start after a short journey (ie engine warm). The first thing I would think of is the cam sensor.

10th January 2011, 20:49	#8
chrissyboy This is my second home lovely little ford focus. Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: East Dulwich Posts: 7,877 Thanks: 2 Thanked 82 Times in 68 Posts	i agree with the others that is sounds like either the camshaft sensor or the krankshaft sensors ,as it does start i would go with it being the camshaft sensor,i would aso take it back to the garage as they have clearly not sorted the fault and charged you for something that wasnt the problem and of course in their diagnotics checks they should of hooked up to the sensors to look for any bad wave forms, __________________ [ I'm really confused. -I keep dreaming I'm an insomniac Last edited by chrissyboy; 10th January 2011 at 20:52..

11th January 2011, 18:14	#9
stevehotshot Regular poster Rover 75 Connoisseur SE tourer Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Wrexham Posts: 86 Thanks: 14 Thanked 7 Times in 3 Posts	starting problem i had problems with CDT difficult to start after short journeys and it was the in-tank fuel pump, as advised on this site. problem worse when low on fuel. i.e. less than 120 miles left according to computer. changed pump insert (£90ish) and fine now. (i am a relative newbie and wondered why this suggested solution hadn't come up yet, as it was one of the first things i'd picked up from using this site.) also did plenum drains as mine started cutting out after right turns, ...water splashing into ECU.. absolutely brill now...what a car!