MGZT CDTi Mk2 2004 135+ Alternator Headache

[Kez]

41k miles ZT. super clean and under used. Garaged all its life and new to me.

After having the car up on blocks for a few days to get the wheels refurbished, and with everything running perfectly beforehand, the battery/charging light came on on putting everything together again.

On testing everything the running voltage was down at 11.8. Engine off voltage 12.3.

I have changed alternator brushes in situ before now on my old 2005 ZT, which I owned for 5 years carrying out all types of maintenance and repairs, and am happy with regulator change etc.

All wiring appears to be perfect with no damage.

Drive belt in perfect condition and super tight.

Swapped battery out for a known good one, and still the same issue.

Checked fuse 14 (later fusebox in my case) and all ok.

Checked plenum... bone dry.

Ordered a replacement regulator which I fitted.. now the battery light is on up to about 2000 rpm, then goes off... voltage at this point would be about 12.6

I know that when everything is running as it should, I should be seeing 14.3 volts or thereabouts. Obviously I am not.

I still feel it's the alternator but wondering what component apart from the regulator can be bust!??

Is there something else that can drag everything down?

Alternator is the Valeo YLE 000260 120 amp later version. The brushes were plentiful on removal of the regulator, no signs of burning/oil etc.

[Walter]

If it was me I would fit another alternator, perhaps from a scrappy, worth a try,check replacement ,brushes etc before fitting ;)

[MSS]

Check resistance between the slip rings. It should be well less than 5 ohms i.e almost zero.

The rectifier dioded can be checked in situ to give a level of confidence but only if you have knowledge of bridge rectifiers and stator configurations.

This particular valeo is susceptible to the rotor going open circuit.

If in doubt, get it rebuilt with a new rotor, quility bearings, brushes etc. by an automotive electrical pengineer specialising in alternators/starter motor repairs. Cost will be a little less than £100.

I would not bother with one from a scrappy given the effort involved in replacement.

[klarzy]

I got a new Velo from Ebay for less than 100...!!

[Kez]

Thanks to everyone, especially MSS...

Given the time and knuckles involved, together with a need to get it right first time, I have no intention of fitting anything other than new.

MSS you are the second person now to mention the rotor on this Valeo, the other being the famous Martin from Westronics in Ireland (Youtube legend).

I reckon that is going to be it so am bracing myself for the changeover, and the bill from Rimmer Bros.

[klarzy]

Have a look here, they are fine to use, don't for the love of god pay rimmers prices...

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/ROVER-75-MGZS-2-0-TD-CDTi-DIESEL-BMW-ENGINE-BRAND-NEW-120A-ALTERNATOR-99-05-/281749030264?hash=item41998d0578

[Snagger]

Could not agree more about Rimmers prices.,

Variation on the same theme :-

http://startandcharge.co.uk/alt840-alternator.html

[MSS]

Thanks to everyone, especially MSS...

Given the time and knuckles involved, together with a need to get it right first time, I have no intention of fitting anything other than new.

MSS you are the second person now to mention the rotor on this Valeo, the other being the famous Martin from Westronics in Ireland (Youtube legend).

I reckon that is going to be it so am bracing myself for the changeover, and the bill from Rimmer Bros.

I am fortunate in having a small family alternator/starter motor reuild business just 12 miles from me in Ipswich. That is where my informaton came from when I had mine rebuilt last year. They actually keep the rotors for this particular alternator (also fitted to a number of European cars) on the shelf. Fortunately, the rotor only costs about £40.

Interestingly, the business never advertise nor do postal service - just walk in, drop off and collect. Their reputation keeps them more than busy throughout the year.

To those comparing Rimmers prices with the £100 alternators being sold on the bay. The ones on the bay selling for around £105 are cheap far-Eastern rubbish.

Personally, what I did was to buy a used Valeo one for £50 and had it rebuilt so that I ended up with practically a brand new Valeo for less than £150.

[klarzy]

I have had 2 of the ebay ones as I listed and both are rebuilt OEM and have been spot on..:shrug:

[MSS]

I have had 2 of the ebay ones as I listed and both are rebuilt OEM and have been spot on..:shrug:

Before I had mine rebuilt, I phoned three ebay suppliers to confirm that the units they supplied were indeed rebuilt Valeo. Two said no, they were imports from Shina, and the third didn't want to give me a straight answer!

[klarzy]

Before I had mine rebuilt, I phoned three ebay suppliers to confirm that the units they supplied were indeed rebuilt Valeo. Two said no, they were imports from Shina, and the third didn't want to give me a straight answer!

the ones I used are not Velo, they are the newer 120A jobbies...

[MSS]

the ones I used are not Velo, they are the newer 120A jobbies...

As I said, non-Valeo far-eastern imports;)

The original items on the 75 - both the 100A and the 120A - are Valeo units.

[klarzy]

As I said, non-Valeo far-eastern imports;)

The original items on the 75 - both the 100A and the 120A - are Valeo units.

well whatever they are they do the job and don't break the bank...:}

[MSS]

well whatever they are they do the job and don't break the bank...:}

I agree. Enjoy!

[Kez]

I have gone with Rimmers and a brand new YLE000261 (the replacement 120 amp model) for just £132.50. I gather this might not actually be a Valeo but at least it is the recommended alternative. We will see.
Nevertheless, it should arrive on Monday and then I can go for the changeover.... Perhaps on Wednesday. So wish me luck.
My last Valeo ran in my 05 ZT to 276,000 miles with just a single brush change, and I will be able to get my old one re-rotored to keep as a hot spare for the future.

[Kez]

Snagger.... Thanks for your "top and side" suggestion.. That looks much better than removing the Aircon pump etc from the bottom (which I was going to go with)
The great thing about my new motor is that everything is pristine clean under the hood, it almost makes you look forward to working on it :)

[SD1too]

... under the hood ...
The bonnet Keron. ;)

Simon

[SD1too]

... get it rebuilt with a new rotor, quality bearings, brushes etc. by an automotive electrical engineer specialising in alternators/starter motor repairs. Cost will be a little less than £100.
:wot: :iagree:
This is excellent advice. Horner Brothers (http://www.hornerbros.co.uk/) of Mildenhall offer a postal service and I can recommend their work and resourcefulness very highly.

Simon

[daisey]

Is there not an alternative alternator from a different car that would fit and be cheaper? They all push out the same voltage. What about a BMW one??????:shrug:
Sometimes you can take the full internals of one and put them inside another so the brackets pick up.;)

[MSS]

The one for our cars isn't exactly expensive - not for a 120A alternator from a major manufacturer.

Equally, less than £100 for a complete rebuild is very competetive.

[Kez]

Given more time, I would have explored the rebuild options in more depth.
I really needed to know that there could be a fault apart from the regulator or the brushes, which we have established there can be (the rotor).

I commute about 1000 miles a week and am currently doing so in an MGF (which was laid up for the winter and has been dragged out into emergency service) in snow and gales, rather than in my ZT.

[Kez]

On the subject of Rimmers and other specialist motor factors, I think we have to be careful to support them.

I run a 2004/5 MG ZT, a 2000 MGF and a 1951 Land Rover 80inch.
All of these cars are obsolete but, thanks to the services of those named above, together with other similar companies, my three vehicles are all still on the road in fine fettle.

If I had to rely on scrapyards, @bay and dodgy foreign imports, they wouldn't be.
I know that sometimes they might feel a bit pricey, but they are there, stocking all the unprofitable bits and bobs we would all have trouble finding otherwise.
It's not always about cheapest... These guys need our custom in order to provide for us.

[klarzy]

I agree with Kez to an extent, but Rimmers need to be more realistic with their pricing mark up...

for example it is not hard to find fair condition xenons on the market for say 170-200.00 a pair... Rimmers price is over 1100.00 a pair with vat... I bet they do not sell many pairs of them except to insurance jobbies.... and we wonder why the insurance companies write so many cars off...:duh::duh:

in order to keep the marque alive all spares need to be sensibly priced, either that or everyone scrap the cars and buy ford focus's...:shrug:

[SD1too]

It's not always about cheapest...
:iagree:
Indeed it isn't, as Mr. Brunel famously said when building the Great Western Railway, and we'd be hard pushed to find a finer engineer than him.

I run a ... 1951 Land Rover 80inch.
:drool4: Nice!

... it is not hard to find fair condition xenons on the market for say 170-200.00 a pair... Rimmers price is over 1100.00 a pair with vat...
Are you comparing like with like Peter? It sounds as if "fair condition" xenons will be second hand.

Simon

[MSS]

Rimmers are often criticised for their pricing. But who else stocks all the single bolts and nuts at prices like 80p each?

Also, without their free parts diagrams, most of us would be completely lost.

[klarzy]

:iagree:
Indeed it isn't, as Mr. Brunel famously said when building the Great Western Railway, and we'd be hard pushed to find a finer engineer than him.

:drool4: Nice!


Are you comparing like with like Peter? It sounds as if "fair condition" xenons will be second hand.

Simon

given the choice between OEM second hand xenons with repolished lenses for 220 (with new lamps) and new OEM xenons from Rimmers (don't know if they come with lamps) 1100

880.00 difference... no brainer for me...;) that's a whole new car, or perhaps two...:shrug:

[SD1too]

Peter,

That may be so on a financial basis, but second hand parts carry more risk. They may have polished lenses but there might be other faults, so it's not really fair to criticise Rimmer's pricing of a brand new 'perfect' part with one which has been partially refurbished. I have to agree though that I would not pay £1,100 for a pair of headlamps.

Simon