That old tyre question, again!

[DavidJ]

Nearly time for new tyres on my ZT weasel, and as my buisness mileage is now approaching 30k miles p.a. I am moving from Continentals to budget.

I don't drive hard, can be found under the speed limit - at all times, and nurse my car along at 50mpg +. So I don't need super sticky tyres, I do need alternative sizes though as the 225 45 18 is rare.

225 40 18 would give me an accurate speedometer, that would be nice. Is this a better option than 235 40 18 (maintaining the width for clearance, but loosing a little sidewall or increase the width and maintain the sidewall height).

Any opinions?

[Mike]

Continental do a budget range at about half price of their premium tyres. I've got them on the front of my car and they are imo very good. I'll hunt out the name and post it :)

Mike

[GreyGhost]

The ZT suspension and steering geometry setup was originally designed around the Michelin Pilot Sport, these are becoming prohibitively expensive.
As development went on they switched to Continentals, advice from the former MGR homologation engineer Nic (Rincewind) The Conti M3 is now the tyre of choice. At £20 - £30 less than the Michies, 225/45/18 are the size the car was designed to use, but the other sizes you mention have been used by others with no ill effect.

There will be more posts to come on this subject so hang on for more replies and perhaps from those with personal experience.

[driverjgp]

Continental do a budget range at about half price of their premium tyres. I've got them on the front of my car and they are imo very good. I'll hunt out the name and post it :)

Mike

Quite a few of the top brand name do a budget tyre.

[Tim]

I've got Conti M3's on both my cars, suits the way I drive. Yes you can get good budget tyres, but why gamble with the part of the car touching the road.

[Keith]

Bare in mind if you move away from the recommended profile you could come unstuck (literally) if you have a mishap and the insurance company loss adjuster notices.

I bought a Kumho (sp?) for my full size spare that cost about £75

[JP53]

Nearly time for new tyres on my ZT weasel, and as my buisness mileage is now approaching 30k miles p.a. I am moving from Continentals to budget.

I don't drive hard, can be found under the speed limit - at all times, and nurse my car along at 50mpg +. So I don't need super sticky tyres, I do need alternative sizes though as the 225 45 18 is rare.

225 40 18 would give me an accurate speedometer, that would be nice. Is this a better option than 235 40 18 (maintaining the width for clearance, but loosing a little sidewall or increase the width and maintain the sidewall height).

Any opinions?

I would buy the better quality tyres it's what keeps you on the road!

[JAYKAY]

I had always replaced my Mich Pilots with same until last month - because of cost I decided to give Kumho's a try. I can tell you that the difference is hardly noticable my ZT-T sticks like ***t to a blanket on my local testing road and roundabout!!:driving:

I shall try out the Conti M3's next time round and certainly steer clear of Mich Pilots from now on.

JK

[dickydido]

Just had fitted 2 x Falken FK 452 (220/45/18) to the front of the CDTi today.
£110 each !!

I had a little look around at available options i.e. Hankook and Kumho and Falken and they all seemed to be similar price wise however the Falken is the better looking tyre (if a tyre can be good looking that is) it also seems to have a good reputation.

Anyway have only driven it about 10 miles back from the garage today and the first thing that i noticed was how much quieter thay are than the thread bare Mitchelins that were on there before

I have about 600 miles to do this week so I will report back

[Tim]

Just had fitted 2 x Falken FK 452 (220/45/18) to the front of the CDTi today.
£110 each !!

I had a little look around at available options i.e. Hankook and Kumho and Falken and they all seemed to be similar price wise however the Falken is the better looking tyre (if a tyre can be good looking that is) it also seems to have a good reputation.

Anyway have only driven it about 10 miles back from the garage today and the first thing that i noticed was how much quieter thay are than the thread bare Mitchelins that were on there before

I have about 600 miles to do this week so I will report back

£110, not bad. Got my Conti M3's for £137 each

[maxi_crawf]

I have Toyo Proxes CF1 tyres on mine, 225/45 17 and they work quite well I think.

maxi_crawf

[DavidJ]

Got my new tyres fitted today, 225 45 18 Federals - £130.00 for a pair and then £20 for new valves fitting and balancing at a local tyre fitters. A straight £150 all in for the rear wheels, the last Continental I got was £135 fitted for one.

[M47Rman]

Can't comment on tyres for the 75, as we have not changed them as yet, but certainly on our previous Rovers, we have found Kumho tyres to be excellent. Good price, no adverse affects on economy or noise, good (low) wear rates but excellent adhesion levels.:) They would be my choice and recommendation for a budget brand. Would steer well clear of any Dunlop budget brands, as we have had belt failures on two different cars with these tyres.
Andy

[DavidJ]

Got my new tyres fitted today, 225 45 18 Federals - £130.00 for a pair and then £20 for new valves fitting and balancing at a local tyre fitters. A straight £150 all in for the rear wheels, the last Continental I got was £135 fitted for one.

Well 2.5k Miles on, and they are not such a bargain. The tyres are wearing unevenly and the ride and noise has deteriorated. I have had them re balanced but there is a constant vibration due to the uneven wear - you can feel it if you run your hands around the tyres (the same on both rears).

The garage that does my maintenance thought they were probably too hard for the "agressive" rear set up of the suspension on a ZT. Looks like I will be going back to Continentals as soon as the vibration starts to really annoy me.

I drive like an angel, this is not due to "Stunt Driver" activity.

[MartinW]

Interesting feedback. I went with Maxxis 245/40 18 about 18mths ago as 4 fitted were £330 all in. I had always stuck with the original Michelin Pilots, usually paying around £600.

However, whilst the Maxxis have covered 20k miles as the Michelins would have done, there has been a lot of vibration in the last 5k miles and I agree, they are not the bargain they seemed, so next time I think it will be back to Michelin.

[JohnDotCom]

Im Afraid it seems you do get what you pay for with Tyres and its always best to have good rubber under your Feet.
Im still using Good Year F1 Eagles and have no problems with these and they are very quite!

[tigerchubs]

Tyres are one of the most critical component on any vehicle. We buy cars based on their handling, braking, ride comfort, performance etc. Then we put on substandard tyres, that usually have a marked effect in one or more of these areas. I would never base my choice on price but on all round performance. I personally always use goodyear tyres. I dont have lots of spare cash but what price do you put on safety.

[JohnDotCom]

Tyres are one of the most critical component on any vehicle. We buy cars based on their handling, braking, ride comfort, performance etc. Then we put on substandard tyres, that usually have a marked effect in one or more of these areas. I would never base my choice on price but on all round performance. I personally always use goodyear tyres. I dont have lots of spare cash but what price do you put on safety.
That is what I was saying, tyres keep you on the road, and general complaints about the Handling in Wet Weather, and Noise etc are generally down to cheaper makes, I know you can shod our cars for under £200 but a decent set may cost you nearer the £500 mark. It also depends how you drive and the model of course.

[Dave Goody]

I've got Nankangs, very cheap and I have found good roadholding, they have done 10k and are still showing 4mm of tread. Its all very well saying buy the best, all of our wallets vary in thickness and I guess my ZT on cheap [not nescessarily bad] rubber will corner better than a Cortina on Michelins?
Dave

[martin1973]

In December paid £220 for a pair of Toyos and £300 incl tracking for Michellins.

Have paid around £250 a pair for the contis but get rubbish milage 12k at best, but they seem fairly soft grippy compound, have found this on previous cars on 15s and 16s

[Dave Goody]

Can a tyre expert confirm this,
Cheap tyres are normally a soft compound and wear quickly?
Soft compounds are normally better for roadholding?
Hard compounds wear better [as Michelin]?
Hard Compounds don't hold the road as well?

errr, do's this mean cheap tyres can be better for roadholding? Dave

[Simon]

Can a tyre expert confirm this,
Cheap tyres are normally a soft compound and wear quickly?
Soft compounds are normally better for roadholding?
Hard compounds wear better [as Michelin]?
Hard Compounds don't hold the road as well?

errr, do's this mean cheap tyres can be better for roadholding? Dave

Cheap tyres are normally harder compounds or compounds that arent as tight on quality (ie one batch may be softer than a previous batch). Generally they will be taylored for long-term wearing (harder compound) but you will lose out on traction because of this.

As you say, harder compounds wear slower but at the expense of traction. A soft compound will give you much better road holding but will wear much much quicker.

And then there's the wet and dry conditions sitiuation..... along with tread pattern.... shoulder profile..... oh dear, this could get very complicated!!! :oops: ;)

[Dave Goody]

Cheap tyres are normally harder compounds or compounds that arent as tight on quality (ie one batch may be softer than a previous batch). Generally they will be taylored for long-term wearing (harder compound) but you will lose out on traction because of this.

As you say, harder compounds wear slower but at the expense of traction. A soft compound will give you much better road holding but will wear much much quicker.

And then there's the wet and dry conditions sitiuation..... along with tread pattern.... shoulder profile..... oh dear, this could get very complicated!!! :oops: ;)

So we are saying cheap tyres may last longer and are cheaper? :lol:

[Simon]

So we are saying cheap tyres may last longer and are cheaper? :lol:

Nope. ;)

Cheap tyres are made of poorer quality rubber compounds that although may be of a 'harder' compound they will suffer from less precise quality controls and moulding processes which will ultimately lead to uneven or quicker wear, increased road noise, poorer road holding, less water-dispersion and greater rolling resistance due to the just-mentioned poorer quality materials.

Of course, this only really applies to budget-type tyres and those of an unbranded nature. Any decent tyre company will make a very good tyre that will perfrom very well.

The usual rule of "if you've heard of them as a reputable brand then the chances are they are a reputable brand" holds a lot of truth.

Original Manufacturer specifications will nearly always give the best results as they have been able to test all combinations and provide you with a tyre that is best suited for performace, reliablility and noise levels. Aftermarket ones will almost certainly give you the same results, it's just a case of experimenting to find which ones are acceptable in your eyes (and wallet).

And that, of course, is the big word. Wallet. It all comes down to what we can afford. Personally (and this is only my personal opinion) is to stick with the OEM spec'd tyres. Currently my rear two tyres need replacing and although the Continental Sport M3's cost a fair whack I accept this and I'm prepared to save and buy them based on recommendations and my experience with them already (ie very good).

I'd recommend going with the very best you can afford. Even better is to save a little longer where reasonable safe and sensible to do so in order to get a better quality tyre. Stick with manufactures recommendations but by all means try different brands of equal specifications. ;)


Blimey... thats a long post. Sorry about that! :o :lol:

[JohnDotCom]

So we are saying cheap tyres may last longer and are cheaper? :lol:
What is strange in Tests (confirmed by AutoExpress Tests) is that the Tread Patterns do make a lot of difference, more so in the Wet. But Stranger Still was that the UniRoyal Rain Tyre came only in middle ranking in the Wet?

There is so much detailed information on what makes a good Tyre it would fill all the Treads, but cheaper Rubber the main problem appears to be as they wear the tread gets looser and so alters the ride & handling Characteristics. But it is true to a certain degree that harder tyres do last longer.

If your happy with your Tyres thats also fine, but stopping distances in emergency stopping tests have showed the best tyes can stop in a quarter of the distance of Poor tyres.

[Countach]

Nearly time for new tyres on my ZT weasel, and as my buisness mileage is now approaching 30k miles p.a. I am moving from Continentals to budget.

I don't drive hard, can be found under the speed limit - at all times, and nurse my car along at 50mpg +. So I don't need super sticky tyres, I do need alternative sizes though as the 225 45 18 is rare.

225 40 18 would give me an accurate speedometer, that would be nice. Is this a better option than 235 40 18 (maintaining the width for clearance, but loosing a little sidewall or increase the width and maintain the sidewall height).

Any opinions?

yes, DON'T!!

Your tyres are your first, best and last defense,
I've had my brakes fail, butsome awesome tyres got my peugoet round the corner, but some cheap&nasties saw a corsa become a combine harvester...and my mates Rover 420 recently went from a wallowing barge on couriers to a Q-car on new Yokohamas!

If you don't drive hard, then your tyres will last, BUT if you are forced by some :twonk: :twonk: in a bus/corsa/truck to take evasive action then your cheap tyres can become hideously expensive....

I've tried the original Contis(V.good), Michelin pilotsports(Impressive), and Now Toyo T-1R's(too soon to rate),
I've also heard good things about the Falkens.
If you don't know the make, or noone here has tried them, move away.
I paid £115 for the Toyos, shop around, if you get really stuck I have some Michelins in the garage....

as regards Size, check with your insurers first! but have a look at my attached file, if you goto 225/40 you lose sidewall depth and will get a harsher ride... 235/40 is a better bet.


Hope that helps
Jonathan

[Rincewind]

Hi chaps,

this is just to tag on from an issue that's been brought up on the Two-Sixties web site regarding fitting wider tyres.

The 18" wheels are based on 7.5Jx18x50 alloys and take the 225/45 tyres we all love to go and find.

However, looking at the ETRTO book (European T yre and Rim T echnical Organisation) where all the approved wheel and tyre combinates are laid down and manufacturers have to follow it for type approval requirements, the 235/40 18 tyres requrie a minimum of 8J width rims. This means putting the 235/40 tyre on a 7.5j rim could potentially (I'm not saying that it will) be an issue. The recommended width is an 8.5J with 8J being the minimum.

just something to think about.

Nic

[Keith]

Good point Nic

It is one of those no no type things people really shouldn't do like fitting a tuning box without declaring it but do.

Fine till one get caught, has a mishap or whatever and then you have potentially given the insurance company a good excuse to invalidate your claim should they choose to do so.

[Rincewind]

I only tend to worry about things like that (hence the reason I stick with OE stuff) simply because I see things at work that would make your toes curl when they go wrong and one of the tests that we sometimes have to do are blow out/tyre delfation tests to see what happens to a vehicle and I also believe is something that tyre manufacturers have to do when desiging tyres for rims.

I'll have to check by I'm sure that a tyre is approved to fit on certain rims as per Regulation 30 and taking a tyre away from a designated rim is outside of a manufacturers ability to predict what the tyre wil do under extreme conditions and so on.

My job is great, but heck, you don't half think about things!

[MartinW]

Having had a read through the thread again and taking all teh comments on board, I have decided to go back to the factory size, and have just ordered 4 Conti M3 225/45/18 tyres via Black-Circles for local fitting all inclusive at £560 for all 4.

It will be interesting to see how these work out as the Michelins I usually had were always excellent tyres.