I'm pure gutted

[lady zed]

Just had the air con checked. There is a leak but worse than that it's dead jim, dead. Fan isn't coming on and he said something about the ECU. Said I'm looking at £5/600. On top of the alternator earlier in the week, the struts, brakes etc etc etc bloomin etc I'm seriously considering cutting my losses and getting rid. The clutch is no 100%, it's tricky sometimes to get it into gear, esp reverse, I don't want to throw anymore money at it.

Worse case scenario I ignore the fan problem and live without air con, what's the worst that can happen?

[James.uk]

>>>Worse case scenario I ignore the fan problem and live without air con, what's the worst that can happen?<<<

Nothing. I doubt the car will overheat. Many people have been running around blissfully unaware that they have no cooling fan working (CDT models) for years..

I am sorry your car has so many problems. It may be a good idea to live with it for a while untill you get chance to save up.. :o :shrug:

Serious question to myself.. Would I recomand buying a Rover 75 to a friend? -- hmm -- Honest answer. No... :(

I would advise them to buy an Asian make.. :shrug:
.

[stocktake]

Seriously doubt ECU problem, 2 or 3 speed fan? if 2 speed probably resistor has gone.

Cannot help with leak on air con but a leak is a leak, once found it can be repaired

[The_Monk]

Who checked the aircon? Might be best to see an aircon specialist that just does aircon.

[Simon]

Air-Con will not operate (it's designed that way) if none of the fan speeds are working, I believe. (someone tell me if I'm wrong though!)

[lady zed]

Interesting. The air con WAS working immediately after being re-gassed and it continued to work for a couple of weeks, then I assumed all the gas leaked out and it quit. So it might not be the fan?

[chrislloydie]

Air-Con will not operate (it's designed that way) if none of the fan speeds are working, I believe. (someone tell me if I'm wrong though!)

AFAIK, Aircon will still work with no fan speeds working, however it will be under great strain when car is standstill and may struggle to blow cool air. When car is moving, wind acts to cool the condensor and so aircon will usually blow cold. At least this is how mine was. I think after a while the condensor gets knackered tho if no cooling fan. Some people who have no cooling fan just turn the aircon off when in traffic etc.

[justmicky]

AFAIK, Aircon will still work with no fan speeds working, however it will be under great strain when car is standstill and may struggle to blow cool air. When car is moving, wind acts to cool the condensor and so aircon will usually blow cold. At least this is how mine was. I think after a while the condensor gets knackered tho if no cooling fan. Some people who have no cooling fan just turn the aircon off when in traffic etc.

My experience of air conditioning (not necessarily car related) is that if you have a lack of coolant, whether it be liquid flow or air flow related, then you have got problems, and in an air conditioning system I would expect to see a high pressure trip in operation.
A condenser cannot get knackered if there is no coolant, however the efficiency and the operation of it can, and therefore the operation of air conditioning unit as a whole is affected - and ultimately some form of h.p. trip in operation.

I would be inclined to think that if there is a fault on the fan, the aircon will not work - just my opinion.

[chrislloydie]

My experience of air conditioning (not necessarily car related) is that if you have a lack of coolant, whether it be liquid flow or air flow related, then you have got problems, and in an air conditioning system I would expect to see a high pressure trip in operation.
A condenser cannot get knackered if there is no coolant, however the efficiency and the operation of it can, and therefore the operation of air conditioning unit as a whole is affected - and ultimately some form of h.p. trip in operation.

I would be inclined to think that if there is a fault on the fan, the aircon will not work - just my opinion.


I was just going by how mine operated when my fan was completely dead, ie no speeds working. I could still use my aircon, however it only blew ice cold when the car was moving, when at standstill the performance of the aircon dropped. I was told by member Jules to not use the aircon without working fan as this would damage the condensor.

[justmicky]

Yep, sure, nothing personal Chris. I am just offering up my two penneth in the hope it can shed some light on the subject. I have been known to be wrong on lots of occasions....just ask my wife :D

[chrislloydie]

Yep, sure, nothing personal Chris. I am just offering up my two penneth in the hope it can shed some light on the subject. I have been known to be wrong on lots of occasions....just ask my wife :D

No offence taken mate, I am very limited in my knowledge regarding the aircon system. However after having trouble with my cooling fan I was just relaying how mine performed. Still, with these cars anything could be possible! :D

[Departed]

I don't know what the actual problem is. What I do know is there are an awful lot of 'experts' out there who don't have the faintest idea, and know that 'the ECU' sounds expensive and makes people go away.

The ECU for the aircon is Nippon Denso and is one of the parts I've never, not ever, heard of going wrong. Doesn't meant it isn't that, just not very likely.

So I'd get the car to someone who knows what they are talking about before worrying about massive bills and getting rid. Only wish you were closer to one of us.

[StevenWilliams]

If the aircon was filled properly the first time it will have dye added. This dye will be bright and easily visible showing you exactly where the leak is.

Sounds like the aircon has a leak AND the fan is not working but I'b be careful about doing anything with the ECU until you have 1. fixed the fan and 2 fixed the leak.

Scooter. You bought the car from a garage. What warranty did you get?

[lady zed]

Only wish you were closer to one of us.

Have car, can travel. :D



Scooter. You bought the car from a garage. What warranty did you get?

Hee haw. Zilch. None. Cowboy. Never again.


So I'm hearing.........get teh fan and leak fixed and worry about the ecu if and when I have to?

[Departed]

Just a thought. The fact that the aircon ECU isn't something that seems to go wrong, means they do tend to be one of the cheapest bits on fleabay.

So even if it is, in the most unlikely list, it should be cheap.

But once again you need someone who knows, not a guesser.

Another observation. Dye in the refrigerant? Can be put in to find a tricky leak, but isn't normal practice. So I wouldn't use this as any real indicator.

[lady zed]

I'm also thinking that if it were the ECU would there not be other symptoms?

[Departed]

Have car, can travel. :D



Hee haw. Zilch. None. Cowboy. Never again.


So I'm hearing.........get teh fan and leak fixed and worry about the ecu if and when I have to?

What. To the Midlands?

You'd be welcome, but it's a looooong way.

Mind you, you came to Cosford so I can see your point.

If you get no joy, I could tell you what's wrong (I have a testbook T1 and a working knowledge of the systems), but don't have the kit to fix aircon stuff (as in charging station).

[StevenWilliams]

Another observation. Dye in the refrigerant? Can be put in to find a tricky leak, but isn't normal practice. So I wouldn't use this as any real indicator.

It would be if the garage was any good. Never been to one that didn;t put it in anyhow.

[Departed]

It would be if the garage was any good. Never been to one that didn;t put it in anyhow.

What on a plain refill?

If looking for a problem, yes. But I still say not standard practice at anywhere I've come across.

[StevenWilliams]

What on a plain refill?

If looking for a problem, yes. But I still say not standard practice at anywhere I've come across.


It's to late to add it if the gas has already leaked and it's illegal to put refrigerant gas into a system you suspect already has a leak for pollution reasons.


Most automated machines now add it by default.


All the places I have been to over the years have added it as a rule including the stingiest of them all Kwik Fit.

[bl52krz]

Have car, can travel. :D



Hee haw. Zilch. None. Cowboy. Never again.


So I'm hearing.........get teh fan and leak fixed and worry about the ecu if and when I have to?
know ziltch about air con. you have a computer? get on the internet and put in "air conditioning". you will find plenty to read and learn about. i did.
i do believe that if the gas is low in the system, the trinary pressure switch, will not allow the compressor to work, therefore the aircon will not work, to save it from damage. yours did work after re gassing, so if there is a leak, when the pressure goes down, it will stop working.
there must be an aircon specialist near you. put your charm on, and go and see them.

[JohnDotCom]

Anna highly unlikely the ECU is gone.
I would personally give Jules a Ring for further advice and cost on Fan front,
and could be well worth a short break to North Wales,
as with the Fan side checked and corrected and his contact with the Air Con specialists,
and I have a brand new Compressor, should be able to sort any problems if you are stuck.
As stated by several members, when the Air Con is refilled,
most of the modern Legal machines now put in a Dye first to check for leaks.
This should be visible and the test would indicate if you had a leak (normally).

To see if you have a 2 speed fan.
Look through front grille at roughly the 2 o'clock position and you should see a large resistor silver in colour.
If that is there,
you have a 2 speed fan and only problem will be the resistor I'm sure.
No resistor generally indicates the old unreliable 3 speed fan I'm afraid.

[lady zed]

Anna highly unlikely the ECU is gone.
I would personally give Jules a Ring for further advice and cost on Fan front,
and could be well worth a short break to North Wales,
as with the Fan side checked and corrected and his contact with the Air Con specialists,
and I have a brand new Compressor, should be able to sort any problems if you are stuck.
As stated by several members, when the Air Con is refilled,
most of the modern Legal machines now put in a Dye first to check for leaks.
This should be visible and the test would indicate if you had a leak (normally).

To see if you have a 2 speed fan.
Look through front grille at roughly the 2 o'clock position and you should see a large resistor silver in colour.
If that is there,
you have a 2 speed fan and only problem will be the resistor I'm sure.
No resistor generally indicates the old unreliable 3 speed fan I'm afraid.

We have our trailer tent, always fancied Wales ;)

I check for the fan tomorrow but I'm sure (after peering today) there's no resistor there. I was peering today as this was the first time I'd lifted the bonnet unassisted. My previous 2 cars had wee sticks that poked through the grill for you to open the bonnet, this one you have to stick your perfectly manicured fingers under and pus a lacth type thing back. Mucky business. I'll take a picture tomorrow.

[lady zed]

Incidentally I have no idea if my fan works or not. At all. Low or high. I don't think I've ever heard it. Probably means it isn't eh.

[relpet]

Deepest sympathy, scooterchick. I bought my car on eBay earlier this year so no warranty either. Took car to recommended garage on Wednesday for free check over before taking car to France for the summer. Told them about screeching aircon. They told me cooling fan was dead and needed replacing. Today I had work done. A 2-speed Kenlowe fan had already been fitted previously but was broken and housing had been broken. Had also been incorrrectly wired. With cost of replacement parts and labour I'm about £600 lighter than when I woke up this morning. But, on 40 mile drive home in hot, humid weather the aircon never screeched once. Moreover, the economy fan system works, which it had not done before. Driving around Toulouse in heavy traffic in temperatures 35+ degrees without aircon not an option for me so a necessary expense. However, garage did confirm what many here say, diesel engine runs so cool that you could run it for years with no fan without a problem, just no in-car ventilation except for windows down. Then you'll get misting problems with the windows up in the rain. The next big bill will be the last, though. From past experience you have to recognise when to stop.

[lady zed]

From past experience you have to recognise when to stop.

That's point I'm not sure if I've reached or not. I'd have been happy to stretch to maybe £200 to get it sorted, but at the moment I feel like I'm throwing good money after bad, know what I mean? I'm seriously cheesed off.

[lady zed]

Oh and another thing. Twice kwif fit re-gassed it and twice their system said 'no leaks'. Just thought I'd mention that.

[GreyGhost]

You really need a specialist aircon company. The automated equipment used by KF and others will report only a full charge. They cannot diagnose a leak, just that it need refill.

Hope it's sorted soon after all the heartache you had with the last 75. These things are sent to try our patience.

[Departed]

You really need a specialist aircon company. The automated equipment used by KF and others will report only a full charge. They cannot diagnose a leak, just that it need refill.

Hope it's sorted soon after all the heartache you had with the last 75. These things are sent to try our patience.

I'd second the comment about the automatic machines.

They pull a vacuum, and see if it will hold it. Any proper leaks will show up, but little ones won't.

All cars a few years old will have something that needs work, even if it's only a simple as a set of new tyres. I've worried about the 'good money after bad' in the past, but I reckon if you fix things properly, you know it's fixed and it's one less thing to worry about if you buy another car. See it as an investment.

[2Diesels]

Anna
if you dont get sorted there's a friend of mine down here who's very good with aircon & more importantly very honest if a bit's !*^%ed he'll tell you straight & if it aint he wont replace it just to make money out of you, put it this way our local Kwik-Fit use him instead of doing it themselves as they were presented with the equipment but received no training & instead of fumbling around had the sense to farm it out to someone who knows the score.
First thing is get the cooling fan sorted though as you would be wasting your time in my opinion.

Just a thought
Regards Col