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Old 12th June 2021, 22:10   #21
COLVERT
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Originally Posted by Mean & Green View Post
The voltage put out by the alternator is not what the stop start system is looking at. The battery voltage without help from the alternator is what it’s looking at. Along with whatever load is being put onto the electrical system, such as heating, lights, wipers, air con and so on.

A battery may well start the car well enough under more regular circumstances, such as at the very start of a journey until manually switching the car off. However if the battery isn’t healthy enough to carry out repeated start ups particularly on a short run - then the car will decide not to activate stop start. This is to protect the battery and help keep things running as they should.

This contradicts your theory that it’s a ploy to make money as if they were just looking to do that, they’d design the car to just continually keep doing restarts until the battery can’t take the load anymore and fail.

In most cases the problem is people using cars for ridiculously short journeys which doesn’t charge the battery properly. Journeys where their own two legs or two legs plus two wheels could easily take them, which would further help with CO2, but that’s another subject.

Cars and car batteries like to be used for decent runs, that’s the only problem here.
Thank you for your input.----Rotten idea isn't it.
The idea was, I guess, to invent something to lower emissions and aid drivers. However it's starting to cause problems and additional costs for the car owners. It seems they didn't do their market research enough or they would know better how the owners would use their cars.--Most are used for lots of daily starts and stops. Motorway use is much less likely.

As they say---'The proof of the pudding is in the eating'.---This pudding is starting to taste rotten.


Thalidomide seemed like a good idea at the time too.---Mistakes in design do get made. They are now trying , perhaps, to apply a patch to this problem.--If they don't it won't go away on its own.


Quote:--
This is to protect the battery and help keep things running as they should.

Simple answer.---Fit a larger battery.

Crazy to have to design a system to protect the battery.

I've never seen any figures to say how much protection the atmosphere gets from this strange and poorly thought out idea. ( Including the pollution caused by having to produce more batteries because their life is cut in half and killing off the starter motors by the same amount. )

REf: my post on air liners. Lots of times they have excess fuel dumps over towns and villages. Plus what they burn. Start there with stopping air pollution.--Never; because the motorists are easy targets.--Always have been and always will be.---

Last edited by COLVERT; 12th June 2021 at 22:24..
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Old 13th June 2021, 11:26   #22
Mean & Green
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Originally Posted by COLVERT View Post
Thank you for your input.----Rotten idea isn't it.
The idea was, I guess, to invent something to lower emissions and aid drivers. However it's starting to cause problems and additional costs for the car owners. It seems they didn't do their market research enough or they would know better how the owners would use their cars.--Most are used for lots of daily starts and stops. Motorway use is much less likely.

As they say---'The proof of the pudding is in the eating'.---This pudding is starting to taste rotten.


Thalidomide seemed like a good idea at the time too.---Mistakes in design do get made. They are now trying , perhaps, to apply a patch to this problem.--If they don't it won't go away on its own.


Quote:--
This is to protect the battery and help keep things running as they should.

Simple answer.---Fit a larger battery.

Crazy to have to design a system to protect the battery.

I've never seen any figures to say how much protection the atmosphere gets from this strange and poorly thought out idea. ( Including the pollution caused by having to produce more batteries because their life is cut in half and killing off the starter motors by the same amount. )

REf: my post on air liners. Lots of times they have excess fuel dumps over towns and villages. Plus what they burn. Start there with stopping air pollution.--Never; because the motorists are easy targets.--Always have been and always will be.---
Fitting a larger battery isn’t going to make any difference if the battery is in a poor state of charge from lack of use. The battery is perfectly adequate, if it’s not low in charge.

Do you have any data to support your argument about stop start being pointless? Anything at all to suggest that congested traffic in town centres with rows of cars using stop start systems doesn’t help reduce CO2?

The motorist gets penalised, because many journeys made by motorists could be made better. You can’t get around the fact that a plane is needed to transport people and cargo around the world. We can help to reduce emissions when people are burning fuel sitting in a jam going for a pint of milk.

Every little helps.
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Old 13th June 2021, 14:32   #23
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Fitting a larger battery isn’t going to make any difference if the battery is in a poor state of charge from lack of use. The battery is perfectly adequate, if it’s not low in charge.

Do you have any data to support your argument about stop start being pointless? Anything at all to suggest that congested traffic in town centres with rows of cars using stop start systems doesn’t help reduce CO2?

The motorist gets penalised, because many journeys made by motorists could be made better. You can’t get around the fact that a plane is needed to transport people and cargo around the world. We can help to reduce emissions when people are burning fuel sitting in a jam going for a pint of milk.

Every little helps.
Pointless because of the almost microscopic effect effect this will have on pollution compared to all the other ENORMOUS amounts of pollution from all the gas producing giants that surround us.

To me it's a bit like an old lady weeing in the sea to be told she has now raised the ocean level.

The data I use to support my evidence goes under the title of---common sense--( A commodity not too easy to find as we are continuously being fed lots of misinformation about just about everything in our lives. )

I know that you, personally, don't always accept the written word as gospel without having a think about what you are being told as the truth. --Take my post for instance. You seem to be giving it some consideration in order to reply to it.---Is IT the truth or lies fabricated by me.--


Just consider the smoke screens the government have been issuing to us mere mortals about Covid.

I won't go on cos this thread is about what I personally see as a waste of time and money in the stop/start system that has baffled many owners.


We all have our own opinions. I think it's useless-----You think it's a good thing.---


All I can say is---Bon Chance.---







Appropriate smilley.








Last edited by COLVERT; 13th June 2021 at 14:35..
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Old 13th June 2021, 15:09   #24
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Pointless because of the almost microscopic effect effect this will have on pollution compared to all the other ENORMOUS amounts of pollution from all the gas producing giants that surround us.

To me it's a bit like an old lady weeing in the sea to be told she has now raised the ocean level.

The data I use to support my evidence goes under the title of---common sense--( A commodity not too easy to find as we are continuously being fed lots of misinformation about just about everything in our lives. )

I know that you, personally, don't always accept the written word as gospel without having a think about what you are being told as the truth. --Take my post for instance. You seem to be giving it some consideration in order to reply to it.---Is IT the truth or lies fabricated by me.--


Just consider the smoke screens the government have been issuing to us mere mortals about Covid.

I won't go on cos this thread is about what I personally see as a waste of time and money in the stop/start system that has baffled many owners.


We all have our own opinions. I think it's useless-----You think it's a good thing.---


All I can say is---Bon Chance.---







Appropriate smilley.







Well the total combination of all cars on the roads are far from microscopic, but whatever.

If every single motorist in the world took a pee in the sea several times a day, I’m not sure what the result would be TBH. I’d imagine it wouldn’t be ideal. Where do we draw the line? Why recycle at home? I mean one more glass jar ending up in landfill won’t matter eh?

Before owning a stop start car, I didn’t really see the point. However after getting used to it, I now fail to see the point in needlessly idling when not moving for a period of time. I’ve not heard of increased failures in starter motors or anything else. They have a beefier starter, shut down at TDC to facilitate an easier start and also have the monitoring system to decide if it’s best for the car to shut down or not.

The OP’s car most likely just wants a good run. The car is actually operating as it should and conserving the less than healthy battery. But if you want to believe the whole system is a load of cobblers - that’s fine. It doesn’t mean you are correct.

With regards to common sense, the whole issue we’ve had with Covid is because of the general population’s lack of it. It’s been clear what it was and what we needed to do from the start, but many many thousands thought they knew better.

Oh well!

Last edited by Mean & Green; 13th June 2021 at 15:15..
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Old 13th June 2021, 15:22   #25
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I deactivated the start stop on my Kuga, pain in the backside if you ask me .

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Old 13th June 2021, 16:45   #26
COLVERT
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I deactivated the start stop on my Kuga, pain in the backside if you ask me .

Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk
Thank you very much Sir.----A post from a thinking man.---Very refreshing.----
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Old 13th June 2021, 16:57   #27
COLVERT
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Well the total combination of all cars on the roads are far from microscopic, but whatever.

1/--If every single motorist in the world took a pee in the sea several times a day, I’m not sure what the result would be TBH. I’d imagine it wouldn’t be ideal. Where do we draw the line? Why recycle at home? I mean one more glass jar ending up in landfill won’t matter eh?

2/--Before owning a stop start car, I didn’t really see the point. However after getting used to it, I now fail to see the point in needlessly idling when not moving for a period of time. I’ve not heard of increased failures in starter motors or anything else. They have a beefier starter, shut down at TDC to facilitate an easier start and also have the monitoring system to decide if it’s best for the car to shut down or not.

3/--The OP’s car most likely just wants a good run. The car is actually operating as it should and conserving the less than healthy battery. But if you want to believe the whole system is a load of cobblers - that’s fine. It doesn’t mean you are correct.

4/--With regards to common sense, the whole issue we’ve had with Covid is because of the general population’s lack of it. It’s been clear what it was and what we needed to do from the start, but many many thousands thought they knew better.

Oh well!
Item 1/--Sewage from just about everywhere in the world ( This includes plastic items. ) is daily discharged un-treated directly into the oceans.--- The small amount you mention would go un-noticed amongst that lot.---

Item 2/--Fair enough.

Item 3/--Agreed, I might not be correct but on the same basis you might not be either.---

Item 4/--More than a hint of it missing in government also don't you think ??





PS. By the way. I really genuinely like your car.--Very smart.----
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Old 13th June 2021, 18:26   #28
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Pointless because of the almost microscopic effect effect this will have on pollution compared to all the other ENORMOUS amounts of pollution from all the gas producing giants that surround us.

Exactly. The vast majority of pollution is produced by human activity, and there are WAY too many of us for the poor old planet to handle.


A population cut of about 80% would do it - anything else is little more than "virtue signalling"
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Old 13th June 2021, 22:03   #29
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Oooops. Forgot to say this in my previous post.

Quote:--Well the total combination of all cars on the roads IS far from microscopic, but whatever.-

Now a 'however' to your 'whatever'.--

Are you saying as a point of discussion that ALL the cars on the road throughout the world have start/stop systems ???--( You do say total. ) Sorry but I can't agree with you there.--

Probably less than I million I would guess. But that's just a guesstimate. --

In my humble opinion I would think the exhaust gases from the worlds total number of butts would exceed by trillions of percents the CO2 being saved from these crazy stop/start systems.---Lol.

Oh !!! and don't forget to add cattle to this vast source of CO2 as well.
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Old 14th June 2021, 10:03   #30
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Oooops. Forgot to say this in my previous post.

Quote:--Well the total combination of all cars on the roads IS far from microscopic, but whatever.-

Now a 'however' to your 'whatever'.--

Are you saying as a point of discussion that ALL the cars on the road throughout the world have start/stop systems ???--( You do say total. ) Sorry but I can't agree with you there.--

Probably less than I million I would guess. But that's just a guesstimate. --

In my humble opinion I would think the exhaust gases from the worlds total number of butts would exceed by trillions of percents the CO2 being saved from these crazy stop/start systems.---Lol.

Oh !!! and don't forget to add cattle to this vast source of CO2 as well.
No you’ve misunderstood what I was getting at.

The total number of cars will add up to a good percentage of pollution. Going forward as an attempt to try helping the situation and not add to the issue, new cars are fitted with stop start. No it’s not the be all and end all, it is just a way to try and do something rather than doing nothing and keep on just adding more and more cars to the roads sitting in jams idling.

It really isn’t a bad thing. Having two cars in our fleet with it, it’s no hardship to live with. Considering electric is a long way from being a real alternative, I think doing what ever can be done to help keep combustion cars as a viable option is a good thing.
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