RAC report into headlight dazzle

[torque2me]

Originally Posted by SteveThackery

To be fair, though, all car lighting must comply with EU (and British) regulations regarding brightness, colour, position, size, angle of visibility, etc.

Car makers may well indulge themselves when it comes to styling, but cars with non-compliant lighting wouldn't find their way into the showrooms.

Perhaps the regulations need reviewing?

Woah there! Are the authorities really checking on imports or just taking the manufacturer/importer's words they are in compliance. They accepted diesel data form the EU without checks. It took the Americans (not EU members) to blow the chumminess out of the window.
Kev

[torque2me]

A really good post Stewart. I hope someone will have the relevant regs to hand? If not a e-mail to the DVSA will be in order.

Kev

[daveo138]

Originally Posted by Plezier

Well it's all down to the idiot designers and manufacturers and their never ending chase for what they think looks good.

Not just lighting, either.

My current company car seems to have a lot of 'features' which have been designed by recent college graduates, who have probably never had to drive long distances on a daily basis. It's all about style over function and practicality.

I don't think I have ever hated a car as much as this one. I can't wait to retire and use my 75 as a daily driver.

[SteveThackery]

Originally Posted by StewartIngram

Now to get back to my point of the legal 55W max with headlight. How are leds described in regulations? Is there now a change to something like lumens (a light measurement) defined or what? Or are manufactures just putting the brightest ones on that they can find? Also, look at a sidelight, that uses multiple leds each in the same housing, so is the bulb (in filament terms) much more than the old 5W max?

I don't know, but I think it is illegal to fit LED bulbs as a substitute for halogens, because as you say, they have a completely different radiation pattern so a reflector designed for halogen bulbs won't give the same illumination pattern when an LED is fitted.

I checked in Halfords a couple of weeks ago, and all of the LED headlight bulbs had an "Illegal to use on public roads" (or words to that effect) notice somewhere on the packaging.

Of course, headlights designed for LEDs from the off are a different matter altogether. They can easily be made to comply with the same beam pattern regulations as halogen headlights. So we should differentiate between "designed for LED" headlights, and "retrofitted with LED bulbs" headlights. The former should be fine, the latter could be anything from OK to dreadful.

[SteveThackery]

Originally Posted by torque2me

Woah there! Are the authorities really checking on imports or just taking the manufacturer/importer's words they are in compliance. They accepted diesel data form the EU without checks. It took the Americans (not EU members) to blow the chumminess out of the window.
Kev

Most regulatory authorities allow self-certification, because to do otherwise would be totally impractical. As you say, testing every new model of car for compliance with every relevant regulation would be impossible, plus it leads to all sorts of arguments around what constitutes a "new" model. It's the same with domestic electrical appliances: in Europe the CE mark indicates that the manufacturer asserts that the product is fully compliant with all relevant construction and safety regulations. Imagine the size of the organisation that would be required to test them all!

In my experience with product development the system works well because the fines for breaches are enormous and EU law demands that the CEO, or appropriate alternative, is personally responsible for compliance and prosecutable under the law. That is probably the one aspect of the law that really focuses the minds.

Of course, the one case where it doesn't work is China. In general Chinese manufacturers don't give the slightest toss about compliance with regulations and happily apply fake certifications to any old c r a p. How many products do you have that mistakenly have "CE" on them instead of "C E" (a big space between the letters)? I've got loads.

The VW diesel scandal is one of the rare cases that self-certification doesn't work perfectly. It was only by chance that non-compliance was spotted in the US - America also accepts self-certification. I suspect that someone in VW told themselves that what they were doing wasn't strictly illegal (even though it certainly contravened the spirit of the law). However, once spotted the regulators and lawyers kicked in and massive fines plus compensation were imposed on VW, which is what's supposed to happen. You can bet your last dollar they won't be doing that again, which is also what's supposed to happen.

[hinged_bap]

i looked up the highway code, it says in section 114 about MUST NOT DAZZLE:
https://www.highwaycodeuk.co.uk/ligh...uirements.html


How do you measure dazzle

[The Rovering Member]

Apart from the roads being overrun with poorly designed or adjusted headlights, non-compliant bulbs & badly fitted modifications, how on earth do the manufacturers get away with headlights that are extinguished every time the integral indicator is illuminated?

[torque2me]

Originally Posted by SteveThackery

Most regulatory authorities allow self-certification, because to do otherwise would be totally impractical. As you say, testing every new model of car for compliance with every relevant regulation would be impossible, plus it leads to all sorts of arguments around what constitutes a "new" model. It's the same with domestic electrical appliances: in Europe the CE mark indicates that the manufacturer asserts that the product is fully compliant with all relevant construction and safety regulations. Imagine the size of the organisation that would be required to test them all!

In my experience with product development the system works well because the fines for breaches are enormous and EU law demands that the CEO, or appropriate alternative, is personally responsible for compliance and prosecutable under the law. That is probably the one aspect of the law that really focuses the minds.

Of course, the one case where it doesn't work is China. In general Chinese manufacturers don't give the slightest toss about compliance with regulations and happily apply fake certifications to any old c r a p. How many products do you have that mistakenly have "CE" on them instead of "C E" (a big space between the letters)? I've got loads.

The VW diesel scandal is one of the rare cases that self-certification doesn't work perfectly. It was only by chance that non-compliance was spotted in the US - America also accepts self-certification. I suspect that someone in VW told themselves that what they were doing wasn't strictly illegal (even though it certainly contravened the spirit of the law). However, once spotted the regulators and lawyers kicked in and massive fines plus compensation were imposed on VW, which is what's supposed to happen. You can bet your last dollar they won't be doing that again, which is also what's supposed to happen.

Whilst I understand and accept that it might be a big job to check all imports Steve, it would still be possible especially if the importers paid for the check. Trading Standards is not a huge organisation but it does do checks and acts on tip-offs. Let's say, sample testing is possible whereby a vehicle is taken by VOSA/DVSA and checked. Might take a week and so probably 50 per year say. You would not have to sample check again for, say, 3 years. As you say, China is the knock off shop of the world and thus there should be checks and tests on their products.

Kev

[bl52krz]

Flashing rear or front lights on bicycles are illegal. They must be a ‘solid’ light source. (On or Off.) Only vehicle’s with flashing lights are:- Police, Ambulances, Doctors, Fire Vehicle’s. They must also be a specific colour, not white.

[daveo138]

Originally Posted by bl52krz

Flashing rear or front lights on bicycles are illegal. They must be a ‘solid’ light source. (On or Off.) Only vehicle’s with flashing lights are:- Police, Ambulances, Doctors, Fire Vehicle’s. They must also be a specific colour, not white.

Not so.

https://www.gov.uk/government/public...ycles-lighting

“ General guidance and advice on the legislative requirements in Great Britain relating to lights and reflectors on pedal cycles. The use of lighting and reflectors on pedal cycles is regulated under the Road Vehicles Lighting Regulations 1989, as amended. The most recent amendment affecting pedal cycles is Statutory Instrument SI 2005 No. 2559 which came into force on October 23 2005.

The main effect of this amendment was to permit flashing lights on pedal cycles. The flashing lights have to conform to certain requirements.

Obligatory lighting and reflectors
Any cycle which is used between sunset and sunrise must be fitted with the following:

white front light
red rear light
red rear reflector
amber/yellow pedal reflectors – front and rear on each pedal
The lamps may be steady or flashing, or a mixture, for example steady at the front and flashing at the rear. A steady light is recommended at the front when the cycle is used in areas without good street lighting.”