Ringing Sound When Raising Clutch

JefferiesFarnol · 2nd June 2022, 07:40

Hello Chaps,

I've had this problem for a while and did ask my garage to investigate it but they came back with nothing and said they couldn't even hear it!

The problem is a sort of moderate ringing/whining sound as I raise the clutch through bite and the car moves off. Sometimes it will do it a lot, or not at all and usually only ever occurs in 1st but it has done it to a lesser extent when changing to 2nd. It is more common when the car is under more strain, for instance, if there is more weight or when moving off on a hill.

I think it is certain to be a part of the clutch assembly just wearing out, from the internet it seems it could be the thrust bearing which I have read is part of the slave cylinder on 75s/ZTs.

Eventually I know I'll have to have a whole clutch, slave and master cylinder renewal but for the time being I can live with it as I would say the clutch still has a few more miles left. Also, I don't think it's serious, I just thought I'd share in case anybody has had a similar experience.

COLVERT · 2nd June 2022, 14:31

It could just be a loose bit of bodywork with a resonant frequency to match that of the clutch as you pull away

chris75 · 2nd June 2022, 16:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by COLVERT

It could just be a loose bit of bodywork with a resonant frequency to match that of the clutch as you pull away

That's an interesting thought !
I have a similar whirring sound when letting the clutch up , but only when the engine is still cold

I have assumed that the thrust bearing is beginning to wear and put it on the to-do list . The whole clutch setup was changed about 40k miles ago .

JefferiesFarnol · 2nd June 2022, 18:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by COLVERT

It could just be a loose bit of bodywork with a resonant frequency to match that of the clutch as you pull away

That is a worthy suggestion, somebody else said to me that engine mounts can sometimes loosen and make a noise. I do wonder how that can be determined, though.

When I bought the car I had a very hairy time on an incredible steep hill when I had to stop for another car on a bend at about a 35 degree angle. The clutch just gave up on me and combined with a dodgy handbrake (now repaired) it made for a hair-raising time! It had been in storage for six years before I bought it and so I put that down to (figurative) rustiness and thankfully it's not really done it since.

Retap · 3rd June 2022, 13:27

Our MK2 ZTT does that and its just had new clutch and engine mounts last year, i suspect the DMF is a little ringy as its springs are getting on and I always endevour to exploit the diesels torq at low rev which doesnt help.

With this car I have come to a solid diagnosis technique that has seen us alright so far....

When an unusual noise presents turn radio to 12, if noise can still be heard turn radio to 17. If noise cannot be heard at 17 and ALL wheels still on the car then carry on dont worry until the noise can be heard at 17 or above. If noise can be heard at 17 or above when ACDC are playing on the radio then park up the car and do a full inspection not forgetting to leave wallet on top of engine for easy and rapid access.

Obv this should not be relied upon to diagnose a fault with your car.

JefferiesFarnol · 3rd June 2022, 17:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Retap

Our MK2 ZTT does that and its just had new clutch and engine mounts last year, i suspect the DMF is a little ringy as its springs are getting on and I always endevour to exploit the diesels torq at low rev which doesnt help.

With this car I have come to a solid diagnosis technique that has seen us alright so far....

When an unusual noise presents turn radio to 12, if noise can still be heard turn radio to 17. If noise cannot be heard at 17 and ALL wheels still on the car then carry on dont worry until the noise can be heard at 17 or above. If noise can be heard at 17 or above when ACDC are playing on the radio then park up the car and do a full inspection not forgetting to leave wallet on top of engine for easy and rapid access.

Obv this should not be relied upon to diagnose a fault with your car.

Thank you - with this system I know I will have no more problems!

Retap · 4th June 2022, 13:12

So when you raise the clutch its like a metalic ring but not that loud usually in 1st or 2nd? Just to confirm my ZTT is same and just had new clutch which didnt change that particular noise which is why i suspect its DMF related and not to be worried about unless you hear it above 17 on the radio i done 50K in 4 years with it and only on days im tired it can niggle me but thee radio then goes up to 18.

To rule out body work and mount noises a roling road would be useful or put up the front subframe on axle stands and carefully go through gears at your own risk to rule out loose bodywork etc. When clutch is raised two things happen normally, the rpm increase as you gas causing more boost and ofcourse the DMF engages with gear box, my money is on DMF but its a theory im sure there are members more experienced who might have somethiing better to say...

Defo got that with our Nigel as accelerate through the lower gears it gives a metalic tingy ring that seems to tie in with rpm, not loud but if youe listening for it you know its there but not at cruising speed in top gear. Thats why i point my finger at the DMF springs getting a bit old after all he's done 186K now at age 19.

Try testing the boost by parking up and bring engine slowly up to 2000rpm listening for when or of a ring like comes in as boost threshold is reached, maybe do it both with engine cold and warm? Our ZTT mk2 "Nigel", has a little ringy flute like noise coming in from 1800rpm that can be heard when parked but when driving it cannot be heard above road noise and just repaird hole in intercooler plus new orings it must be sort of normal for this age car? That boost noise is a bit different to the tingy ring you describe but worth getting ears famailiar with.

I often find myself getting overly anxious with some the noises and sometimes just hav to accept a 20 yr old vehicle will have some quirks so long as engine runs smooth without backfire and no fluid is lost and no light on dash etc. Im told the clutches on our cars are robust its the master n slave cylinders that fail first so unless you have loss of clutch pedal or cluch fluid leak from bottom of bell housing dont worry about that yet.

JefferiesFarnol · 4th June 2022, 20:54

Thanks for your thoughts.

I will try taking the revs up out of gear to rule that out but mine is a 1.8 non-turbo so it won't be anything to do with the turbo.

I've been meaning to set up a recording one day to try to get the noise and upload it here, it only really comes up in that period in 1st gear where you're sort of having to ride the clutch for a second as you move off which is what made the think it was part of the clutch assembly.

I don't think I'd be that confident trying the car on axle stands as my drive is gravel but maybe I'll get up the courage, it's a good suggestion to rule out the engine mounts. I think I'm like you, I can be quick pinickity and often don't follow the mantra of 'if it ain't broke, don't fix it'. I'm sure this is nothing major to worry about but it's nice to eliminate them when you can.

I'm toying with the idea of upgrading the master cylinder to the all metal one from dmgrs one of these days but I've got some leak fixing, a powerfold retrofit and the fabled orange clip to fit proactively first!

2nd June 2022, 07:40	#1
JefferiesFarnol Avid contributor Rover 75 Tourer Join Date: Aug 2021 Location: Canterbury Posts: 166 Thanks: 64 Thanked 18 Times in 15 Posts	Ringing Sound When Raising Clutch Hello Chaps, I've had this problem for a while and did ask my garage to investigate it but they came back with nothing and said they couldn't even hear it! The problem is a sort of moderate ringing/whining sound as I raise the clutch through bite and the car moves off. Sometimes it will do it a lot, or not at all and usually only ever occurs in 1st but it has done it to a lesser extent when changing to 2nd. It is more common when the car is under more strain, for instance, if there is more weight or when moving off on a hill. I think it is certain to be a part of the clutch assembly just wearing out, from the internet it seems it could be the thrust bearing which I have read is part of the slave cylinder on 75s/ZTs. Eventually I know I'll have to have a whole clutch, slave and master cylinder renewal but for the time being I can live with it as I would say the clutch still has a few more miles left. Also, I don't think it's serious, I just thought I'd share in case anybody has had a similar experience.

3rd June 2022, 13:27	#5
Retap Loves to post MG ZT-T CDTi Join Date: Sep 2020 Location: Lincs Posts: 288 Thanks: 73 Thanked 51 Times in 44 Posts	Our MK2 ZTT does that and its just had new clutch and engine mounts last year, i suspect the DMF is a little ringy as its springs are getting on and I always endevour to exploit the diesels torq at low rev which doesnt help. With this car I have come to a solid diagnosis technique that has seen us alright so far.... When an unusual noise presents turn radio to 12, if noise can still be heard turn radio to 17. If noise cannot be heard at 17 and ALL wheels still on the car then carry on dont worry until the noise can be heard at 17 or above. If noise can be heard at 17 or above when ACDC are playing on the radio then park up the car and do a full inspection not forgetting to leave wallet on top of engine for easy and rapid access. Obv this should not be relied upon to diagnose a fault with your car. __________________ ZT-T Mk2 Jobs to do: Renew auxiliary drive belt # Replace driver door lock actuator # Refurbish wheels Last edited by Retap; 3rd June 2022 at 13:42..

4th June 2022, 13:12	#7
Retap Loves to post MG ZT-T CDTi Join Date: Sep 2020 Location: Lincs Posts: 288 Thanks: 73 Thanked 51 Times in 44 Posts	So when you raise the clutch its like a metalic ring but not that loud usually in 1st or 2nd? Just to confirm my ZTT is same and just had new clutch which didnt change that particular noise which is why i suspect its DMF related and not to be worried about unless you hear it above 17 on the radio i done 50K in 4 years with it and only on days im tired it can niggle me but thee radio then goes up to 18. To rule out body work and mount noises a roling road would be useful or put up the front subframe on axle stands and carefully go through gears at your own risk to rule out loose bodywork etc. When clutch is raised two things happen normally, the rpm increase as you gas causing more boost and ofcourse the DMF engages with gear box, my money is on DMF but its a theory im sure there are members more experienced who might have somethiing better to say... Defo got that with our Nigel as accelerate through the lower gears it gives a metalic tingy ring that seems to tie in with rpm, not loud but if youe listening for it you know its there but not at cruising speed in top gear. Thats why i point my finger at the DMF springs getting a bit old after all he's done 186K now at age 19. Try testing the boost by parking up and bring engine slowly up to 2000rpm listening for when or of a ring like comes in as boost threshold is reached, maybe do it both with engine cold and warm? Our ZTT mk2 "Nigel", has a little ringy flute like noise coming in from 1800rpm that can be heard when parked but when driving it cannot be heard above road noise and just repaird hole in intercooler plus new orings it must be sort of normal for this age car? That boost noise is a bit different to the tingy ring you describe but worth getting ears famailiar with. I often find myself getting overly anxious with some the noises and sometimes just hav to accept a 20 yr old vehicle will have some quirks so long as engine runs smooth without backfire and no fluid is lost and no light on dash etc. Im told the clutches on our cars are robust its the master n slave cylinders that fail first so unless you have loss of clutch pedal or cluch fluid leak from bottom of bell housing dont worry about that yet. __________________ ZT-T Mk2 Jobs to do: Renew auxiliary drive belt # Replace driver door lock actuator # Refurbish wheels Last edited by Retap; 4th June 2022 at 13:36..

2nd June 2022, 14:31	#2
COLVERT This is my second home R75 Saloon. Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: France/or Devon. Posts: 14,003 Thanks: 3,851 Thanked 2,167 Times in 1,816 Posts	It could just be a loose bit of bodywork with a resonant frequency to match that of the clutch as you pull away

4th June 2022, 20:54	#8
JefferiesFarnol Avid contributor Rover 75 Tourer Join Date: Aug 2021 Location: Canterbury Posts: 166 Thanks: 64 Thanked 18 Times in 15 Posts	Thanks for your thoughts. I will try taking the revs up out of gear to rule that out but mine is a 1.8 non-turbo so it won't be anything to do with the turbo. I've been meaning to set up a recording one day to try to get the noise and upload it here, it only really comes up in that period in 1st gear where you're sort of having to ride the clutch for a second as you move off which is what made the think it was part of the clutch assembly. I don't think I'd be that confident trying the car on axle stands as my drive is gravel but maybe I'll get up the courage, it's a good suggestion to rule out the engine mounts. I think I'm like you, I can be quick pinickity and often don't follow the mantra of 'if it ain't broke, don't fix it'. I'm sure this is nothing major to worry about but it's nice to eliminate them when you can. I'm toying with the idea of upgrading the master cylinder to the all metal one from dmgrs one of these days but I've got some leak fixing, a powerfold retrofit and the fabled orange clip to fit proactively first!