KV6 bad engine noise & vibration - looks like I may need to take my car to a garage - Page 3

Bolin · 4th July 2013, 13:23

I can't imagine that the cat would make a sound like the one I'm hearing. How do I tell if it is the cat? The noise is there with the car stationary.

Mind you I did hear a noise like air either being sucked in or being blown out today - the car is hunting very slightly, not much. I know that one of the exhuast boxes looks bad, and will need replacing within the next year I'd say.

Maybe you are on to something, how do I tell? I'd like to check for this tonight if possible, as I want to start pulling the car to pieces asap to check the tensioner (even though it *should* be fine).

wutang · 4th July 2013, 14:42

Hi Bolin,

Don't rule out the tensioner just because it has been replaced, after my second belt change about six months later my developed a horrible noise so sent it back to apple who rang me to say the tensioner had failed and replaced it under warranty. They told me mine was not the first early failure they had seen and were begining to suspect a bad batch from the manufacturer.

The mechanic said mine was not far from falling appart and lunching the valves.

Richard

Bolin · 4th July 2013, 14:57

Richard, when did you get yours replaced?

Mine was done in April 2011 although I guess the tensioner may have been sat in a box for ages, who knows.

Bolin · 4th July 2013, 17:30

OK I've had a tap at the pre-cat and the main cat, there was a very slight 'rustling' noise when tapping the pre-cat and more of a rustling noise when tapping the main cat. I held the flexi section tight when tapping.

Can't see that this 'rustling' noise could produce what I am hearing

Canonite · 4th July 2013, 17:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bolin

OK I've had a tap at the pre-cat and the main cat, there was a very slight 'rustling' noise when tapping the pre-cat and more of a rustling noise when tapping the main cat. I held the flexi section tight when tapping.

Can't see that this 'rustling' noise could produce what I am hearing

I'd not heard the recordings when I posted about the cat, I mentioned it because my old 45 had a dead cat and made a very tinny rattle until one day it just stopped.

Anyway, having listened to the vids i'm not sure. I posted a video on Youtube when I was having the rattle with mine, at the time I suspected it was the power steering pulley hence why the video was more concentrated on that area.
As I said, it turned out to be the tensioner pulley that had disintegrated.
Have a listen and see what you think:

Bolin · 4th July 2013, 18:28

It's not a million miles away from what mine is like.

Mine does seem to be varying a bit, it wasn't as bad when I listerned to it today.

I think I'm just going to have to strip it all down and have a look at the tensioner, especially given what Richard has posted above.

Bolin · 6th July 2013, 16:35

OK got the tensioner (108,500 miles) off, seems OK as far as I can tell, but doesn't have a rubber cover.

The tensioner pulley (8,500 miles), an INA part, has a small amount of play, runs smoothly. Not sure if I'm being picky. Should there be any decernable play at all in these?

The idler pulley (8,500 miles) also has a small amount of play, possibly less than the tensioner pulley, and runs smoothly. Again, should there be any discernable play at all?

Given that both pulleys have a small amout of play, and I do mean small, I'm inclined to think that they are both OK. They both look as old as they are supossed to be and run smoothly and quietly. The belt doesn't have any nasty markings from them. I cannot see ho these could be causing the noise.

Which leaves me thinking big ends and time to take the car to a garage for a professional opinion.....

SD1too · 6th July 2013, 19:15

Colin,

I think it's time for a 'reality check'.

Earlier you said this:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bolin

I don't think the car has been that neglected in the past for a big end or main bearing to have gone, these engines can do 250,000+

I would agree with that, but today you performed a 'U' turn:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bolin

Which leaves me thinking big ends and time to take the car to a garage for a professional opinion.....

What?

Colin, as I understand it you have a noise, but nevertheless the car is running well. Can I ask what evidence you have that your big ends have worn? I suggest that the answer is 'none', except that you're frantically searching for an explanation for a noise which you can't identify. The garage will see you coming. They will be rubbing their hands in glee, knowing that all they have to do is confirm your suspicions and start preparing a four figure invoice!

Colin, please take a deep breath and pour yourself a whisky, then return to what you said today:

Quote:

OK got the tensioner (108,500 miles) off, seems OK as far as I can tell ...

You won't be able to judge the effectiveness of a cambelt tensioner unless you observe it with the engine running. If you can't do that, then after 108,000 miles isn't it more likely that this is the cause of your noise rather than big ends? A cambelt tensioner is much cheaper to replace. Isn't it worth doing that rather than handing a blank cheque to a garage? Why not sleep on it.

Simon

Bolin · 6th July 2013, 19:34

Thanks Simon, I had pretty much made up my mind to replace the tensioner before putting everything back together, it would be more likely to be that at fault. I had assumed that it if was faulty then I'd be able to tell once I had it off the car and could press the plunger myself. Perhaps not

The reason I was suggesting big ends if not the tensioner is that I can't work out what else it could be! I have run out of ideas at the moment.

P.S. the garage would only be used to identify the noise, I'd tell them in advance that whatever it is I'll fix it myself, even if it means replacing the engine! That should put off any mis-diagnosis.

SD1too · 6th July 2013, 19:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bolin

I had assumed that it if was faulty then I'd be able to tell once I had it off the car and could press the plunger myself.

Err ... no! The force required to tension the timing belt is far greater than the strength of your thumb.

Quote:

The reason I was suggesting big ends if not the tensioner is that I can't work out what else it could be!

I thought so. Have you considered opening your own garage?

Simon

4th July 2013, 13:23	#21
Bolin This is my second home Rover 75 2.5 V6 Connoisseur SE 4dr manual Wedgewood Blue 2 04-05/06/2001 Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: N.E. Hampshire Posts: 4,617 Thanks: 289 Thanked 308 Times in 243 Posts	I can't imagine that the cat would make a sound like the one I'm hearing. How do I tell if it is the cat? The noise is there with the car stationary. Mind you I did hear a noise like air either being sucked in or being blown out today - the car is hunting very slightly, not much. I know that one of the exhuast boxes looks bad, and will need replacing within the next year I'd say. Maybe you are on to something, how do I tell? I'd like to check for this tonight if possible, as I want to start pulling the car to pieces asap to check the tensioner (even though it should be fine).

4th July 2013, 14:42	#22
wutang Posted a thing or two Rover 75 2.5 auto (LPG) & mg tf 160 Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Dartford Posts: 1,124 Thanks: 5 Thanked 39 Times in 36 Posts	Hi Bolin, Don't rule out the tensioner just because it has been replaced, after my second belt change about six months later my developed a horrible noise so sent it back to apple who rang me to say the tensioner had failed and replaced it under warranty. They told me mine was not the first early failure they had seen and were begining to suspect a bad batch from the manufacturer. The mechanic said mine was not far from falling appart and lunching the valves. Richard

4th July 2013, 14:57	#23
Bolin This is my second home Rover 75 2.5 V6 Connoisseur SE 4dr manual Wedgewood Blue 2 04-05/06/2001 Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: N.E. Hampshire Posts: 4,617 Thanks: 289 Thanked 308 Times in 243 Posts	Richard, when did you get yours replaced? Mine was done in April 2011 although I guess the tensioner may have been sat in a box for ages, who knows.

4th July 2013, 17:30	#24
Bolin This is my second home Rover 75 2.5 V6 Connoisseur SE 4dr manual Wedgewood Blue 2 04-05/06/2001 Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: N.E. Hampshire Posts: 4,617 Thanks: 289 Thanked 308 Times in 243 Posts	OK I've had a tap at the pre-cat and the main cat, there was a very slight 'rustling' noise when tapping the pre-cat and more of a rustling noise when tapping the main cat. I held the flexi section tight when tapping. Can't see that this 'rustling' noise could produce what I am hearing

4th July 2013, 18:28	#26
Bolin This is my second home Rover 75 2.5 V6 Connoisseur SE 4dr manual Wedgewood Blue 2 04-05/06/2001 Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: N.E. Hampshire Posts: 4,617 Thanks: 289 Thanked 308 Times in 243 Posts	It's not a million miles away from what mine is like. Mine does seem to be varying a bit, it wasn't as bad when I listerned to it today. I think I'm just going to have to strip it all down and have a look at the tensioner, especially given what Richard has posted above.

6th July 2013, 16:35	#27
Bolin This is my second home Rover 75 2.5 V6 Connoisseur SE 4dr manual Wedgewood Blue 2 04-05/06/2001 Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: N.E. Hampshire Posts: 4,617 Thanks: 289 Thanked 308 Times in 243 Posts	OK got the tensioner (108,500 miles) off, seems OK as far as I can tell, but doesn't have a rubber cover. The tensioner pulley (8,500 miles), an INA part, has a small amount of play, runs smoothly. Not sure if I'm being picky. Should there be any decernable play at all in these? The idler pulley (8,500 miles) also has a small amount of play, possibly less than the tensioner pulley, and runs smoothly. Again, should there be any discernable play at all? Given that both pulleys have a small amout of play, and I do mean small, I'm inclined to think that they are both OK. They both look as old as they are supossed to be and run smoothly and quietly. The belt doesn't have any nasty markings from them. I cannot see ho these could be causing the noise. Which leaves me thinking big ends and time to take the car to a garage for a professional opinion.....

6th July 2013, 19:34	#29
Bolin This is my second home Rover 75 2.5 V6 Connoisseur SE 4dr manual Wedgewood Blue 2 04-05/06/2001 Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: N.E. Hampshire Posts: 4,617 Thanks: 289 Thanked 308 Times in 243 Posts	Thanks Simon, I had pretty much made up my mind to replace the tensioner before putting everything back together, it would be more likely to be that at fault. I had assumed that it if was faulty then I'd be able to tell once I had it off the car and could press the plunger myself. Perhaps not The reason I was suggesting big ends if not the tensioner is that I can't work out what else it could be! I have run out of ideas at the moment. P.S. the garage would only be used to identify the noise, I'd tell them in advance that whatever it is I'll fix it myself, even if it means replacing the engine! That should put off any mis-diagnosis.