Bleeding brakes a warning - Page 4

Departed 32016 · 20th March 2011, 10:22

After 2 years of having the zt this is the first time I have heard of sinking pedal problem? What is it

Trophy Blue Tourer · 20th March 2011, 11:15

Hi There!

Just finished fitting a set of 190 (bigger front discs and vented rears) to my CDTI

Obviously needed to bleed the brakes so attached my preasure bleeder its an electric one with a 2ltr tank and did the std furthest from the master cylinder type routine first without using the brake pedal tried for pedal preasure and fine until I started the engine and the pedal sank to the floor in about 5 secs HMMMMM!!!

Did it again but this time gave the pedal 5 strokes per corner with the preasure bleeder running locked it all off and tried again with the same result!!

Intended to give it a quick run up the road in the dark (its Sorned until monday when I can run it in for its retest) so stuck the wheels on while talking to "Clickernick" then got side tracked by SWMBO in to food and Telly! after he left!

Brings us to this morning reading the site for some idears and I find the post above (about having the ignition on and/or the motor running) so as I was going to do an oil/filter change (and possibly G/Box oil) today I shall stick it back on the jacks and remove the wheels and try it again!!

I shall try it on pos 2 first and see!! - if that doesnt work I will redo with the engine running! - and report back!!

I will say that having fitted many new sets of pads/discs/calipers etc I was ready for them to feel a "bit soft" until they all bed in due to heat and use etc!! but not to the floor!! and yes I had used hose clamps etc to prevent air getting into the lines!!

AND I dont remember it doing it before !! (its been off the road 6 weeks while getting the insurance repair and an all over spray job done so I could just be a bit hazy!!

)

Watch this space!!!!

Andy

Trophy Blue Tourer · 20th March 2011, 19:57

Back Again!!

Right I tried both ways - ignition pos2 first with no improvement and with the engine running ! - still no change other than the ABS warning light coming on!!

followed by a certain amount of rude words!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Tried a battery reset while I had a cuppa and trawl through the site on the subject of ABS resets!! 2 options seemed to be offered!! a battery reset (which I was already trying) and the opinion that the car needed to be driven for the system to see that there was no fault before putting the light out!!

Reconecting the battery after my cuppa showed no change sadly!!

I had a worrying hour or so while I finished of the oil and filter change and also the G/Box oil change - remember I have the MOT Retest to do in the morning!!

However having refitted the wheels and the under tray (with some new fasteners and clips) I only had to do 50 yards up the road for the ABS light to disapear

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The brakes happily only need a very light touch to prove very effective!!!

IMHO!! Bleeding in the normal way (with or without a preasure bleeder although it does make it a easy/quick and single handed operation) is all that can be done without the use of a T4 - and with out risk of triggering ABS lights!

Please bear in mind that I still have the SPP!! the pedal IS rock hard without the engine running however!!

I feel a trip to see the nearest T4 owner may well be on the books once funds and time allows to see if using the T4 to rebleed the system will cure the fault !!

Please remember that the above is simply my experiances today and in no way implies anything about other comments or posts!!!!

Andy

Right I know!!

ceetdm · 21st March 2011, 07:44

Thankss very much for your post on this matter Andy :-)

I've just done my brakes all round, last week, including handbrake shoes. I then did a pressure bleed of the brakes (without ignition switch on and without engine running) and have exactly the same outcome as you.

This post has saved me rebleeding with the above variations :-)

My car passed it's MOT last Thusday.

Good luck with your MOT!

Tommy

Clickernick · 21st March 2011, 20:17

Alright Andy???!!!!

Good ere ,,init!!!!

Trophy Blue Tourer · 22nd March 2011, 12:43

Hi Nick!!

Yeh good here! terrible time waster though!!

As the Mrs has made sure to point out!!

Sorry!!

Andy

Departed 32016 · 22nd March 2011, 19:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by kieranswood

After 2 years of having the zt this is the first time I have heard of sinking pedal problem? What is it

No one know then?

xantiaman · 12th May 2011, 19:03

just out of interest what do rover charge for this service?

thebiglad · 9th February 2012, 20:58

Surely you can actuate the abs pump by proving a supply to the abs relay.

I've done this loads of times with LR Discoverys using my Hawkeye tool - all it does is actuate the abs relay.

wuzerk · 10th February 2012, 08:10

With reference to diesels,(I know nothing about petrol models) the sinking pedal when engine is running is normal. It should not sink if the engine is off. The MOT stations have all received notification of this and it should not be a failure point. My theory is that since the vacuum generated for the brake system is done with a pump on the diesels and Any pump should have a relief valve in it somewhere to prevent damage so, perhaps the sinking is when this valve is doing its job? It will not occur when the engine is not on since the vacuum pump is not working then?

20th March 2011, 11:15	#32
Trophy Blue Tourer Gets stuck in MG ZT-T Trophy Blue CDTI Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: Milton Keynes Posts: 883 Thanks: 11 Thanked 25 Times in 18 Posts	Hi There! Just finished fitting a set of 190 (bigger front discs and vented rears) to my CDTI Obviously needed to bleed the brakes so attached my preasure bleeder its an electric one with a 2ltr tank and did the std furthest from the master cylinder type routine first without using the brake pedal tried for pedal preasure and fine until I started the engine and the pedal sank to the floor in about 5 secs HMMMMM!!! Did it again but this time gave the pedal 5 strokes per corner with the preasure bleeder running locked it all off and tried again with the same result!! Intended to give it a quick run up the road in the dark (its Sorned until monday when I can run it in for its retest) so stuck the wheels on while talking to "Clickernick" then got side tracked by SWMBO in to food and Telly! after he left! Brings us to this morning reading the site for some idears and I find the post above (about having the ignition on and/or the motor running) so as I was going to do an oil/filter change (and possibly G/Box oil) today I shall stick it back on the jacks and remove the wheels and try it again!! I shall try it on pos 2 first and see!! - if that doesnt work I will redo with the engine running! - and report back!! I will say that having fitted many new sets of pads/discs/calipers etc I was ready for them to feel a "bit soft" until they all bed in due to heat and use etc!! but not to the floor!! and yes I had used hose clamps etc to prevent air getting into the lines!! AND I dont remember it doing it before !! (its been off the road 6 weeks while getting the insurance repair and an all over spray job done so I could just be a bit hazy!!) Watch this space!!!! Andy

20th March 2011, 19:57	#33
Trophy Blue Tourer Gets stuck in MG ZT-T Trophy Blue CDTI Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: Milton Keynes Posts: 883 Thanks: 11 Thanked 25 Times in 18 Posts	Back Again!! Right I tried both ways - ignition pos2 first with no improvement and with the engine running ! - still no change other than the ABS warning light coming on!! followed by a certain amount of rude words!!!!!!!!!!!!! Tried a battery reset while I had a cuppa and trawl through the site on the subject of ABS resets!! 2 options seemed to be offered!! a battery reset (which I was already trying) and the opinion that the car needed to be driven for the system to see that there was no fault before putting the light out!! Reconecting the battery after my cuppa showed no change sadly!! I had a worrying hour or so while I finished of the oil and filter change and also the G/Box oil change - remember I have the MOT Retest to do in the morning!! However having refitted the wheels and the under tray (with some new fasteners and clips) I only had to do 50 yards up the road for the ABS light to disapear!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! The brakes happily only need a very light touch to prove very effective!!! IMHO!! Bleeding in the normal way (with or without a preasure bleeder although it does make it a easy/quick and single handed operation) is all that can be done without the use of a T4 - and with out risk of triggering ABS lights! Please bear in mind that I still have the SPP!! the pedal IS rock hard without the engine running however!! I feel a trip to see the nearest T4 owner may well be on the books once funds and time allows to see if using the T4 to rebleed the system will cure the fault !! Please remember that the above is simply my experiances today and in no way implies anything about other comments or posts!!!! Andy Right I know!! Last edited by Trophy Blue Tourer; 20th March 2011 at 20:02..

21st March 2011, 07:44	#34
ceetdm Loves to post Rover 75 CDTi Manual Saloon + Rover 75 CDTi Auto Saloon Join Date: May 2007 Location: Edinburgh Posts: 417 Thanks: 170 Thanked 42 Times in 33 Posts	Thankss very much for your post on this matter Andy :-) I've just done my brakes all round, last week, including handbrake shoes. I then did a pressure bleed of the brakes (without ignition switch on and without engine running) and have exactly the same outcome as you. This post has saved me rebleeding with the above variations :-) My car passed it's MOT last Thusday. Good luck with your MOT! Tommy __________________ Rover 75 Saloon CDTi Contemporary SE +pack

21st March 2011, 20:17	#35
Clickernick Posted a thing or two Rover 75 Connie SE Tourer Triumph Street Triple R Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Bletchley, Milton Keynes Posts: 1,163 Thanks: 75 Thanked 91 Times in 65 Posts	Alright Andy???!!!! Good ere ,,init!!!! __________________ Real walnut interior. Original refurbished Forked Spokes 16” with Michelin Primacy 4 rubber, Pioneer AVH-Z9200DAB double din Wi Fi phone integration. Retrofitted twin front horns. 160 re-map. Revotec fan. Silicone intercooler hoses and ‘O ring’ replacement. Top hose thermostat. New walnut and smokestone steering wheel with cruise upgrade. Brembo Brakes. Ceramic coated rear Exhaust. L/engine mount, Hydramount, Bosch MAF. Focal Access Drivers and Focal Amp.

10th February 2012, 08:10	#40
wuzerk Passed Away Rover 75 CDT 03 auto Conn. SE Join Date: May 2009 Location: London Posts: 2,885 Thanks: 104 Thanked 254 Times in 204 Posts	Sinking pedal With reference to diesels,(I know nothing about petrol models) the sinking pedal when engine is running is normal. It should not sink if the engine is off. The MOT stations have all received notification of this and it should not be a failure point. My theory is that since the vacuum generated for the brake system is done with a pump on the diesels and Any pump should have a relief valve in it somewhere to prevent damage so, perhaps the sinking is when this valve is doing its job? It will not occur when the engine is not on since the vacuum pump is not working then? Last edited by wuzerk; 10th February 2012 at 08:22..

20th March 2011, 10:22	#31
Departed 32016 This is my second home Rover 75 Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Edinburgh Posts: 5,190 Thanks: 101 Thanked 257 Times in 145 Posts	After 2 years of having the zt this is the first time I have heard of sinking pedal problem? What is it

22nd March 2011, 12:43	#36
Trophy Blue Tourer Gets stuck in MG ZT-T Trophy Blue CDTI Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: Milton Keynes Posts: 883 Thanks: 11 Thanked 25 Times in 18 Posts	Hi Nick!! Yeh good here! terrible time waster though!! As the Mrs has made sure to point out!! Sorry!! Andy

12th May 2011, 19:03	#38
xantiaman Avid contributor ROVER 75 SALOON 2.0 v6 connoisseur Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: corsham Posts: 136 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	just out of interest what do rover charge for this service?

9th February 2012, 20:58	#39
thebiglad Regular poster 75 Connoisseur SE CDTi Tourer Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Guéret Posts: 39 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Surely you can actuate the abs pump by proving a supply to the abs relay. I've done this loads of times with LR Discoverys using my Hawkeye tool - all it does is actuate the abs relay.