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Old 3rd December 2020, 04:22   #1
Darcydog
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Default Export of live animals to be banned.

And about time. It was an election pledge from this Government and only achievable by our no longer having to abide by EU Free Trade rules come the end of December.

The RSPCA welcomed the move saying it would be “a landmark achievement for animal welfare”. The RSPCA has campaigned on this issue for more than 50 years.

One local authority in Kent tried to ban live animal exports in 2012 after a lorry load of lame sheep was found at a local Port and the animals were in such a state that they had to be put down.

But the High Court overturned the ban saying it breached EU free trade rules.

This welcome decision really puts the spotlight on what we will be able to do for animal welfare post December.

It also shines a light on the cynical arguments by some on “chlorinated chicken”.
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Old 3rd December 2020, 08:59   #2
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Originally Posted by Darcydog View Post
And about time. It was an election pledge from this Government and only achievable by our no longer having to abide by EU Free Trade rules come the end of December.

The RSPCA welcomed the move saying it would be “a landmark achievement for animal welfare”. The RSPCA has campaigned on this issue for more than 50 years.

One local authority in Kent tried to ban live animal exports in 2012 after a lorry load of lame sheep was found at a local Port and the animals were in such a state that they had to be put down.

But the High Court overturned the ban saying it breached EU free trade rules.

This welcome decision really puts the spotlight on what we will be able to do for animal welfare post December.

It also shines a light on the cynical arguments by some on “chlorinated chicken”.
Whilst I bow to your expert view, surely the export of live animals is and always was surely a choice of whoever owns the animals. I guess it was done for financial need, how will that need now be met. If the countries that wanted live animals before still want live animals where will the new market be. As for chlorinated chicken, is that not a different issue that depends on our trade deal with the USA? I knew a lovely man who kept some cows for milk production, he went bust because he wouldn’t have the male calves slaughtered. His choice, but he slept well. Did the owner of the lame sheep have no responsibility for their welfare, or did the EU free trade deals insist on lame sheep? So looking forward to the sunlit uplands that the oven ready deal is promising! As for election pledges............ fill in the gaps. Usually only use forum for advice on my great 75, will probably stick to this in future as political stuff will cause 😢
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Old 3rd December 2020, 16:53   #3
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My early employment history included a spell in Public Health issues around farming and abattoir involvement in processing livestock with a view to qualifications in Meat Inspection. That was in 1963/4.

10 years later, after the blessed T. Heath stuffed everything up by lying through his teeth, the required drop in husbandry standards and slaughter and processing of foodstuffs was horrific. I doubt if we will ever return to the relatively considerate and gentle techniques we had then but the opportunities will return to these shores. Then, I suppose it's up to the markets.



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Old 3rd December 2020, 17:50   #4
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I'm well aware of how flawed and destructive the CAP is, and it's long overdue for substantial reform. I have no issue with George Eustace's recent announcements, which certainly make a lot of the right noises, should they actually come to fruition. But given this government's track record of grand promises (where's that £10 billion "world-beating" test and trace system that was going to prevent the need for additional lockdowns?), I'll wait to see it actually implemented before I agree that it's really happening. But on this specific issue, I simply don't buy the notion that banning live exports, as encouraging a step forward as it is, will turn the UK into a bucolic paradise - rather, it is likely to mask a wider drop in animal welfare standards as UK farming is forced to compete with imported produce of lower standards than those it currently (but not for much longer) enjoys. Surely you didn't think that a trade deal with the US and others is going to involve a race to the top? Why has the government refused to back up its fine words and election manifesto promises on food standards by putting them into law?

This clip may be of interest: https://www.channel4.com/news/critic...ld-be-affected

As might this article: https://www.theguardian.com/food/202...ing-jay-rayner

The final two paragraphs are worth reproducing in full -

"If cheap, low-standard products are allowed in from the US and elsewhere, British farming will be forced into a cost-cutting war, which will undermine its standards but also threaten its economic base. More farms may go out of business. We risk becoming ever more dependent on those imports. And just slapping tariffs on low-welfare products, as has been suggested, won’t solve the problem. Once they are allowed in, the haggling will begin and inevitably, over time, the tariffs will come down. Surely consumers could just vote with their wallets and not buy those products? In the shops yes. In unlabelled food service – in the school meals our children eat, in the sandwiches we buy from supermarkets – we’ll never know. It’s all a deeply unappetising prospect. And nothing the government has announced recently assures me it won’t come to pass."

PS - my "dystopian fantasy" reference was directed at anyone who might dismiss the issue of antibiotic resistance as being such.
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Old 3rd December 2020, 21:23   #5
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About time in my humble opinion. They can't speak for themselves but they can communicate if we take the time to try to understand them. The recent loss of nearly 6,000 cattle when a ship which was taking them to China went down in the East China Sea was appalling and very thought provoking ... no disrespect to nearly all of the crew who were also lost and their loved ones.
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Old 3rd December 2020, 21:38   #6
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Oh! Beggar it that means I cant send the missus away on her annual holiday. LOL!

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Old 3rd December 2020, 22:42   #7
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Do you agree with Gav that we are better than all of them? Forgive me if this is another stupid question!.
I think that it is good to remain positive ... and to always keep a sense of humour.
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Old 4th December 2020, 09:45   #8
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Perhaps a bit off topic but....

Maybe if we go back to fundamentals.

Farmers are a business. In business trade trumps everything.

It seem to me that currently GREED holds the Ace of Trumps.

And the general culture is that lying/cheating/oneupmanship/fraud/collusion and selling out your principles and ethics are the way to get to holding the Ace.

Is this just my view as I get older and more cynical or is it the reality
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Old 24th March 2021, 19:59   #9
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I keep a few sheep to keep the grass don. Some of what I breed go into the freezer, some I keep to replace the older stock and the remainder I sell at the local livestock market. "Local" is now 25 miles away, it used to be 4 miles away and sold cattle, sheep and pigs but now the only livestock are chickens, goats and ferrets. It is a shame the local markets have gone because of various regulation making me have to take sheep to market 25 miles away. What happens to the sheep I do take to market I dont know. There are restrictions on livestock movements after you bring new stock onto a holding because of foot and mouth, BSE, swine disease etc. The posts before seem to say that the person who sells the sheep or whatever is responsible for the conditions they travel under after sale. Unless one is a big seller of sheep or whatever direct to the abattoir I dont think you have any control as tpo how they are transported. I dont think they should be exported live; why dont folk abroad take slaughtered sheep carcasses rather than live sheep? It may be because Kosher or Halal in the way they are killed? I dont agree with that either. But a carcass is 1/2 the weight of a live sheep and so twice as many sheep carcasses can be transported on the refrigerated truck as on a live transporter. Is it because of cheaper wages elsewhere? Lax application of regulations? Its my impression that the UK bureaucrats (jobsworths??) gold plate the regulations where elsewhere in the EEC application of regs is lax. I could carry on but sorry for boring those who take the trouble to read.
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