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Old 9th March 2021, 17:22   #11
biggles-1
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Evening folks,

I have now removed the flange and the bearing from the shaft, without knowing how it actually would look like. However I now know that installing with presicion will be the tricky part to come.

Started by taking all the measurements, if no edge to press against. Then crushed the bearing, to give me a little more space to use in the press.

I pulled the flange of the shaft quite easily and then pulled the rest of the bearing.

Hm ... NO edge!

The construction is that the shaft is a little thicker where the bearing was installed. I had no problem to move the new bearing along the rest of the shaft on both sides, by hand.

Will assemble the pump after some cleaning, with new parts, gasket, oil seal, O-rings and a the bearing.

The oil seal comes first since it is on the inside of the bearing. Then I proably install the bearing onto the shaft, since I will have to measure the exact position. To install the bearing first into the pump (the normal way) will be tricky since I will not be able to measure properly (no access). The oil seal will not give any resistance but can be fragile during installation.

That´s it, have a nice evening.

Regards Nils
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Old 11th March 2021, 10:12   #12
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Interested to know why you didn't just pull the bearing off the free end Nils? Must admit that's the way I would have done it - a feeler gauge between the flange and bearing would have ensured it went back to the same position on the shaft.
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Old 12th March 2021, 08:59   #13
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Dear Mike,

Please read my Post # 1 and you will see why :-).

I posted to see if someone knew by own experience (no guessings), if the flange had been pressed onto the shaft, if the shaft was even and if their was an edge at the bearing?

I have learned the hard way and have cost me money, that it is often a good idea to think things through in advance :-). To me the dismantle and installation is a slighly more tricky, than it seems at a first look. I want it to be right the first time, because there is no shaft to buy as a spare part.

This is why I did not just pulled the bearing off the free end. Also I do not have a tool that fits into the tiny gap of only 0,2mm (second pump 0,35mm), without pushing the flange the other way (same pressure), since no edge.

Now when I know that the flange was pressed on, the shaft is not even, that the shaft is slighly thicker were the bearing is installed and that their is no edge to push against, it is easy to tell how it should be done.

My apologize if my english makes you guys confused, but I take that most of you do not speak Swedish :-).

Regards Nils
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Old 12th March 2021, 09:09   #14
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Not sure I would have understood any better had it been in Swedish

Interested in where you sourced the gasket between the pump halves as this is the one I've seen (read of) leaking? Could be very handy to know a local source who is perhaps willing to refurbish V6 pumps.

Keep well
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Old 12th March 2021, 09:55   #15
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Hi again Nills, the tool I mentioned in post 8 would have pulled the inner race off.


Because you have a press, another way would be to make several diagonal splits with care across the race with a 1mm cutting disc, making one slit a couple of mm wide then use the press and a sharp chisel split the race, this could also be done manually with a chisel and a heavy hammer.


When using either of these methods care must be taken to cover the bearing with some heavy cloth to contain any flying splinters and it goes without saying that good quality safety goggles, not glasses must be worn.


One thing to remember is that sometimes we learn a lot of things by our mistakes.


It's also nice to see a kindred spirit with the attitude of " I bet I can fix this " .
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Old 12th March 2021, 11:38   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vitesse View Post
Not sure I would have understood any better had it been in Swedish

Interested in where you sourced the gasket between the pump halves as this is the one I've seen (read of) leaking? Could be very handy to know a local source who is perhaps willing to refurbish V6 pumps.

Keep well
Hi Vitesse,

I have spent days (!) searching the market for spare parts. Often, I have found nothing or no reference number, due to the fact that neither MG and in my case Hoborn/Eaton no longer are in business.

In the end I found that a gasket kit to a "FORD Transit (early 2000?)", that I believed would fit by the look of it. It turned out to be ok but not the oil seal that was in NBR. The original is made of flour rubber/FPM, so had to buy them separately (a separate hassle).

I ordered a "test" kit from a Italian company and paid a lot, including shipping. When I actually had the kit in my hand and could see some numbers, I started to search again and found that Meat & Doria was the producer. More searching and I found that I could buy the same kit on Autodoc.se or similar, for a third of the price I had paid. Now I know!

The parts are (to my pumps)!

Meat & Doria part # 37079 (Ford Transit)
https://www.autodoc.se/meat-doria/12886203

BUT I think below would be more suitable for my pumps and cheaper!

Meat & Doria part # 37041 (Land Rover Discovery II)
https://www.autodoc.se/meat-doria/12886165

If I would add a thought, it would be that many spare parts and PAS are as I can see exactly the same, even if given different model and part numbers. For example, the two pumps I have (QVB101411 = HE 1205095/14 and QVB000280 = HE 1205095/22) are to me exactly the same (have dismantled both into pieces). I cannot find any difference between them.

I can also add that I was surprised that so many leads ended up to one of Victor Reinz over 400 companies dealing with auto parts. I had never heard of them before this journey.

That´s it / Nils
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Last edited by biggles-1; 13th March 2021 at 09:33.. Reason: changed FBR to FPM
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Old 12th March 2021, 11:41   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ducati750cc View Post
Hi again Nills, the tool I mentioned in post 8 would have pulled the inner race off.


Because you have a press, another way would be to make several diagonal splits with care across the race with a 1mm cutting disc, making one slit a couple of mm wide then use the press and a sharp chisel split the race, this could also be done manually with a chisel and a heavy hammer.


When using either of these methods care must be taken to cover the bearing with some heavy cloth to contain any flying splinters and it goes without saying that good quality safety goggles, not glasses must be worn.


One thing to remember is that sometimes we learn a lot of things by our mistakes.


It's also nice to see a kindred spirit with the attitude of " I bet I can fix this " .

I had your puller in mind when I wrote the above. However, I do not believe that I can insert the tool into the gap of 0,2mm without risk of moving the flange at the same time, due to the pressure needed.

I have also changed my mind and will first install the bearing in to the casing after the oil seal, since it should give me more control. Then press the flange onto the shaft leaving 2,8 mm of the shaft visible (see post 1). Then press the shaft into the bearing/oil seal, until I have 0,2 or 0,35 mm left, measuring with a feeler gauge. Probably use a rubber mallet the final millimetres since the press builds up pressure and I will lose control.

Seems like we share the same view on learning the hard way and common sense :-). My congenital curiosity has given me a thick forehead due to all things learnt the hard way. However, I would not give it away for anything and by age I have learnt to be nicer to myself :-).

Have a nice weekend / Nils
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Old 12th March 2021, 13:04   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by biggles-1 View Post
Hi Vitesse,

I have spent days (!) searching the market for spare parts. Often, I have found nothing or no reference due to the fact that neither MG and in my case Hoborn/Eaton no longer are in business.

In the end I found that a gasket kit to a "FORD Transit (early 2000?)", that I believed would fit by the look of it. It turned out to be ok but not the oil seal that was in NBR. The original is made of flour rubber/FBR, so had to buy them separately (a separate hassle).

I ordered a "test" kit from a Italian company and paid a lot, including shipping. When I actually had the kit in my hand and could see some numbers, I started to search again and found that Meat & Doria was the producer. More searching and I found that I could buy the same kit on Autodoc.se or similar, for a third of the price I had paid. Now I know!

The parts are (to my pumps)!

Meat & Doria part # 37079 (Ford Transit)
https://www.autodoc.se/meat-doria/12886203

BUT I think below would be more suitable for my pumps and cheaper!

Meat & Doria part # 37041 (Land Rover Discovery II)
https://www.autodoc.se/meat-doria/12886165

If I would add a thought, it would be that may spare parts and PAS are as I cvan see exactly the same, even if given different model and part numbers. For example, the two pumps I have (QVB101411 = HE 1205095/14 and QVB000280 = HE 1205095/22) are to me exactly the same (have dismantled both into pieces). I cannot find any difference between them.

I can also add that I was surprised that so many leads ended up to be one of Victor Reinz over 400 companies dealing with auto parts. I had never heard of them before this journey.

That´s it / Nils
Thanks Nils, think your detective work might benefit others who have asked about gaskets in the past. I remember Genpk down in Australia managed to source one from his Land Rover outlet but never got a part no. The actual pumps are expensive to buy, so your efforts identifying gasket sets/renovating pumps might prove extremely useful

Mike
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Old 12th March 2021, 14:36   #19
Mike Noc
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Quote:
Originally Posted by biggles-1 View Post
Dear Mike,

Please read my Post # 1 and you will see why :-).

My apologize if my english makes you guys confused, but I take that most of you do not speak Swedish :-).

Regards Nils
You are right there Nils - despite working for Tetra Pak for many years and visiting Lund and Malmo many times my Swedish is pitiful - my first visit to Sweden was the port of Ornskoldsvik, and to this day I can't get the pronunciation right.

Quote:
Originally Posted by biggles-1 View Post
I had your puller in mind when I wrote the above. However, I do not believe that I can insert the tool into the gap of 0,2mm without risk of moving the flange at the same time, due to the pressure needed.
I'm lucky I have an SKF puller kit with fingers that fit inside the bearing making it easy to pull off.

Quote:
Originally Posted by vitesse View Post
The actual pumps are expensive to buy, so your efforts identifying gasket sets/renovating pumps might prove extremely useful

Mike
Worth contacting Mickyboy on here for a good value used pump Mike.
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Old 12th March 2021, 14:52   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Noc View Post
You are right there Nils - despite working for Tetra Pak for many years and visiting Lund and Malmo many times my Swedish is pitiful - my first visit to Sweden was the port of Ornskoldsvik, and to this day I can't get the pronunciation right.



I'm lucky I have an SKF puller kit with fingers that fit inside the bearing making it easy to pull off.



Worth contacting Mickyboy on here for a good value used pump Mike.
Thanks for the tip - unfortunately never had much success getting a reply from Mickyboy, same thing with Exeter Road Garage, don't think they like enquires from overseas folk. Nils is also a member of our local FB group, rather like the idea of throwing a few beer tokens his way and getting a renovated pump rather than taking a chance on a used one, don't know if he does though

Keep well

ps. Ornskoldsvik - Urn + shoal (as in fish but with a ds ending) + vik (as in week but substitute w for v) = close enough.
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