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Old 16th February 2018, 18:09   #151
p2roverman
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No picture - I'll try again later
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Old 16th February 2018, 18:17   #152
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Rear of 2-litre engine, front tools fitted, marks on wheels not lined up.. (hopefully with picture this time)
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File Type: jpg P1010880cr.jpg (20.2 KB, 78 views)
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Old 16th February 2018, 18:31   #153
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Quote:
Originally Posted by p2roverman View Post
Thanks, Mike Noc

As suggested, I'm (hopefully) uploading a photo of the secondary belt with the 2-litre engine locked in safe position and the front tools fitted. It can be clearly seen that the marks in the chainwheels are not lined up, and the rear tool will not therefore fit.

Therefore one has to remove the front tools and remove the locking pin to turn the engine slightly in order to engage the rear tool to change the secondary belts. I'm assuming this is what everyone has found, but confirmation would be appreciated.
This what I expected you to post. They are close but not exact. Once the front is all done and tools removed move the crank back or forth to allow the rear tool to slot in. In fact I think I described this earlier in the thread or somewhere anyway.
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Old 16th February 2018, 18:36   #154
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Noc View Post
It is what I expected to see. Haynes has been known to be wrong before - for example they have the clutch master cylinder being supplied with fluid from the brake master cylinder reservoir, similar to the system used on the Vauxhall Astra.



This may help with uploading photos:

https://the75andztclub.co.uk/forum/s...ng+photographs
Haynes probably got it from Rave and I think Rave was written by the service department with no involvement from the people involved with the KV6. I have some old PMs on the other forum from 1955 diesel who mentioned this together with the adjustment of the tensioner pulley were omitted or not described correctly. If I didn't think It would cause arguments I would post everything from him on a separate page.
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Old 16th February 2018, 20:46   #155
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Thanks jn. I had assumed this but really did want confirmation. I'm well aware that so much has been written on posts here over cam belt changing and valve timing on the V6. Much has been made of marking the wheels with Tippex etc, but in fact, if the tools are used it is virtually impossible to go wrong. Might write a simple sequence when I've finished though I'm sure there will be some here, it's just luck if one is able to find the right thread when doing a search.

Immaterial whether main or secondaty belts done first. Only essential thing is to lock the engine while doing the primary belt.

Now replacing the leaking stat before finishing reassembly.
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Old 17th February 2018, 09:08   #156
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Originally Posted by jn12 View Post
I have some old PMs on the other forum from 1955 diesel who mentioned this together with the adjustment of the tensioner pulley were omitted or not described correctly. If I didn't think It would cause arguments I would post everything from him on a separate page.
Well no doubt people will comment John, but the more information we have the better as I see it.

No doubt it would be an interesting read.
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Old 17th February 2018, 17:53   #157
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Quote:
Originally Posted by p2roverman View Post
Thanks, Mike Noc

As suggested, I'm (hopefully) uploading a photo of the secondary belt with the 2-litre engine locked in safe position and the front tools fitted. It can be clearly seen that the marks in the chainwheels are not lined up, and the rear tool will not therefore fit.

Therefore one has to remove the front tools and remove the locking pin to turn the engine slightly in order to engage the rear tool to change the secondary belts. I'm assuming this is what everyone has found, but confirmation would be appreciated.
I am quoting here from the Seeley tools instructions ......
"4.2.9. Some alignment of the exhaust camshaft will be required when installing the rear cam sprocket/belt assembly and therefore it is necessary
to remove and discard the oil seal from the front of the exhaust camshaft in order to fit the spindle from VS1290/01 Locking Tool. This seal
will already have been removed if the front belt has been replaced.
4.2.10. Fit the spindle into the front of the exhaust camshaft (location pin into slot in camshaft) and use it to carefully turn the camshaft to align the
drive slot in the camshaft rear to match the rear sprocket during installation.
Note: For this alignment application the pegs of the Locking Tool Assembly are not located into the camshaft sprocket hubs. Only the spindle of
VS1290/01 Tool is used.


So by their method you don't unlock the engine , just rotate the exhaust camshaft . That's the way I did it and it worked fine ; my v6 runs beautifully !
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Who said it was simples ?
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Old 18th February 2018, 23:39   #158
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chris75 View Post
I am quoting here from the Seeley tools instructions ......
"4.2.9. Some alignment of the exhaust camshaft will be required when installing the rear cam sprocket/belt assembly and therefore it is necessary
to remove and discard the oil seal from the front of the exhaust camshaft in order to fit the spindle from VS1290/01 Locking Tool. This seal
will already have been removed if the front belt has been replaced.
4.2.10. Fit the spindle into the front of the exhaust camshaft (location pin into slot in camshaft) and use it to carefully turn the camshaft to align the
drive slot in the camshaft rear to match the rear sprocket during installation.
Note: For this alignment application the pegs of the Locking Tool Assembly are not located into the camshaft sprocket hubs. Only the spindle of
VS1290/01 Tool is used.


So by their method you don't unlock the engine , just rotate the exhaust camshaft . That's the way I did it and it worked fine ; my v6 runs beautifully !
My tools are Sealey, but bought second hand off ebay so the instructions were missing.

I've now done the main belt but had not progressed further debating on getting new crankshaft pulley, but decided against ir having looked at related posts.

I've considered the Sealey instructions but think that on their own they will not work. Certainly it is the simplest way to turn the exhaust cam so that the pair of wheels with new belt can be fitted, but, as we have seen with the marks on the wheels not in alignment when the engine is locked, it is not possible to fit the rear tool to unbolt or tighten the rear wheel bolts. THere seems to be no option but to release the engine to allow the inlet cam to be turned that small amount so the the rear tool will fit the rear wheel on the inlet cam. Then the front tool (not engaged in the inlet wheel) can be used to rotate the exhaust cam so that the rear tool will engage the exhaust cam wheel as well.

I'm working on a 2-litre engine using the 2-litre tool and assuming the engine has the correct 2-litre camshafts fitted. Did you do the job on a 2.5 litre, and might the rear wheel marks line up on this engine when it is locked?
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Old 18th February 2018, 23:48   #159
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Quote:
Originally Posted by p2roverman View Post
I'm working on a 2-litre engine using the 2-litre tool and assuming the engine has the correct 2-litre camshafts fitted. Did you do the job on a 2.5 litre, and might the rear wheel marks line up on this engine when it is locked?
No, I see you also have a 2-litre. This tool fitting is a bit of a mystery. When starting the job I found that with the engine locked the front tools would not engage the inlet cams by a wheel angle equivalent to about one and a half teeth of the belt. The 2.5 tool looked a closer fit but I didn't try it. I'm working on the basis that using the front tools I can at least get the valve timing back to factory spec. And yes, it does seem normal for the rear wheel marks not to be in alignment when the engine is locked, with the problem of fitting the rear tool as a result.
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Old 19th February 2018, 07:40   #160
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Quote:
Originally Posted by p2roverman View Post
No, I see you also have a 2-litre. This tool fitting is a bit of a mystery. When starting the job I found that with the engine locked the front tools would not engage the inlet cams by a wheel angle equivalent to about one and a half teeth of the belt. The 2.5 tool looked a closer fit but I didn't try it. I'm working on the basis that using the front tools I can at least get the valve timing back to factory spec. And yes, it does seem normal for the rear wheel marks not to be in alignment when the engine is locked, with the problem of fitting the rear tool as a result.
Hi,

Thanks for the picture. This clarifies things a bit up and is in line with the statements from 1955Diesel.

So, the rear sprockets is about 1,5 tooth out on the 2 litre when the flywheel are locked in the safe position?
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