'04 CDTi - Car wouldn't start until I called the recovery people. Immobiliser?

Vantheman · 30th December 2020, 11:17

Hi all

I went out in the car yesterday and drove about 50 miles, parked up and went for a long walk.

When I got back to the car, I sat in it for a few minutes while I had something to eat and drink and then it wouldn't start. Lights came on with the key as normal, but no starter. It was like having a key without the transponder.

Tried a few times. Looked under the bonnet but didn't know what to look for. Made sure everything in the under bonnet fuse box was pushed in. Locked and unlocked car. Tried a few more times. No luck.

Rang the recovery people. Had to walk down the road and look for name of street/church/pub. Then back to the car. Try it one more time and it started. I dared to switch it off and it started again, so I rang the recovery firm again to cancel the call out. The car got me home and started again this morning.

Might be worth mentioning that a few weeks ago I undid the bottom of the inside fuse box and took the trim off the side of the tunnel so I could spray stuff into the recirculating inlet. The car was like this for a while and yesterday was the first day I drove it after putting it back together, although as I've said it worked fine on the outward journey.

Now I'll be wondering if it'll start every time I go to drive it. I suspect there could be a dodgy connector somewhere. Any ideas where to check?

Cheers
Van

planenut · 30th December 2020, 12:03

If everything appeared normal, could you hear anything? I.e. clicking from the engine area. Power problems seem to be accompanied by that. If there were no other indications, check and clean the connectors on the starter motor.

Glad it got you home.

I've had the embarrassment of recovery attending and car started immediately..

steady eddie · 30th December 2020, 12:24

Hi, I wonder if it could be a relay starting to play up as I had something similar only the engine turned over normally but would not fire up this was intermittent, it turned out to be a relay supplying power to the ECU.[This was on a bmw e90 320d same engine as in the rover cdti]

Arctic · 30th December 2020, 12:32

Hi Van.
How many miles as the car covered, usually the starter contacts & plunger wear around the 75,000 100,00 mark, so need changing not an hard job once you have the starter off the car.

As above also check the spade connector on the starter motor it may need cleaning up, if once cleaned and it does happen again then it will be the connectors & plunger inside the starter.

If you do get stuck use a long screwdriver to tap the starter then try and start the car.

Personally i would service the starter.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/ROVER-75-...0/252158920680

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Rogue · 30th December 2020, 13:06

+1 for the starter motor solenoid being the issue. Is exactly how mine would behave before it was refurbished however you should still be able to hear it click once when you try and start it assuming it's not just a bad contact on the spade.

Yorkshire GOC · 30th December 2020, 20:33

Sounds like the crank sensor to me - fails hot then cools down and works OK

Mike Noc · 30th December 2020, 21:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rogue

+1 for the starter motor solenoid being the issue. Is exactly how mine would behave before it was refurbished however you should still be able to hear it click once when you try and start it assuming it's not just a bad contact on the spade.

Yes plus another one - either a poor spade connection or the starter solenoid contacts are on the way out.

Yorkshire GOC · 31st December 2020, 09:46

Hi all

I went out in the car yesterday and drove about 50 miles, parked up and went for a long walk.

When I got back to the car, I sat in it for a few minutes while I had something to eat and drink and then it wouldn't start. Lights came on with the key as normal, but no starter. It was like having a key without the transponder.

Tried a few times. Looked under the bonnet but didn't know what to look for. Made sure everything in the under bonnet fuse box was pushed in. Locked and unlocked car. Tried a few more times. No luck.

Rang the recovery people. Had to walk down the road and look for name of street/church/pub. Then back to the car. Try it one more time and it started. I dared to switch it off and it started again, so I rang the recovery firm again to cancel the call out. The car got me home and started again this morning.

Might be worth mentioning that a few weeks ago I undid the bottom of the inside fuse box and took the trim off the side of the tunnel so I could spray stuff into the recirculating inlet. The car was like this for a while and yesterday was the first day I drove it after putting it back together, although as I've said it worked fine on the outward journey.

Now I'll be wondering if it'll start every time I go to drive it. I suspect there could be a dodgy connector somewhere. Any ideas where to check?

Cheers
Van
Vantheman is offline Report Post

Could be a failing crank sensor - if it happens again and you turn her over watch the rev counter - it it stays still and does not flicker then its the crank sensor. If the ECU at ignition does not receive the CPS signal it will not allow the car to start up - so no starter motor .

Vantheman · 2nd January 2021, 18:50

Thanks for all the replies and sorry I took a few days to get back. Having been moved into Tier 4 I'm not using the car until I go back to work on Monday so I held off looking at it during the coldest days. But I have tried to start it a few times over those days and it's been fine each time.

I had a butchers at the connection to the solenoid and both parts were quite oxidised. Did take a photo but can't work out how to share it. Cleaned the contact on the solenoid with 240 wet or dry and fitted a new crimp to the lead. Reconnected and then smeared on some heavy waterproof grease.

Now I just see if it happens again, but will probably arm myself with the rebuild kit. Thanks for the info and pics on this Arctic. You mentioned mileage - The car's done 100k, went up to this on the actual journey.

Van

30th December 2020, 11:17	#1
Vantheman Regular poster Rover 75 Saloon Join Date: Aug 2020 Location: Dorset/Hampshire border Posts: 55 Thanks: 27 Thanked 10 Times in 6 Posts	'04 CDTi - Car wouldn't start until I called the recovery people. Immobiliser? Hi all I went out in the car yesterday and drove about 50 miles, parked up and went for a long walk. When I got back to the car, I sat in it for a few minutes while I had something to eat and drink and then it wouldn't start. Lights came on with the key as normal, but no starter. It was like having a key without the transponder. Tried a few times. Looked under the bonnet but didn't know what to look for. Made sure everything in the under bonnet fuse box was pushed in. Locked and unlocked car. Tried a few more times. No luck. Rang the recovery people. Had to walk down the road and look for name of street/church/pub. Then back to the car. Try it one more time and it started. I dared to switch it off and it started again, so I rang the recovery firm again to cancel the call out. The car got me home and started again this morning. Might be worth mentioning that a few weeks ago I undid the bottom of the inside fuse box and took the trim off the side of the tunnel so I could spray stuff into the recirculating inlet. The car was like this for a while and yesterday was the first day I drove it after putting it back together, although as I've said it worked fine on the outward journey. Now I'll be wondering if it'll start every time I go to drive it. I suspect there could be a dodgy connector somewhere. Any ideas where to check? Cheers Van

30th December 2020, 12:24	#3
steady eddie Loves to post rover 75 tourer / bmw e90 320d Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Swindon Posts: 255 Thanks: 256 Thanked 48 Times in 24 Posts	Hi, I wonder if it could be a relay starting to play up as I had something similar only the engine turned over normally but would not fire up this was intermittent, it turned out to be a relay supplying power to the ECU.[This was on a bmw e90 320d same engine as in the rover cdti] Last edited by steady eddie; 30th December 2020 at 12:28..

30th December 2020, 12:32	#4
Arctic Give to Learn Freelander 2 Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: West Midlands Posts: 18,708 Thanks: 1,155 Thanked 6,407 Times in 3,874 Posts	Hi Van. How many miles as the car covered, usually the starter contacts & plunger wear around the 75,000 100,00 mark, so need changing not an hard job once you have the starter off the car. As above also check the spade connector on the starter motor it may need cleaning up, if once cleaned and it does happen again then it will be the connectors & plunger inside the starter. If you do get stuck use a long screwdriver to tap the starter then try and start the car. Personally i would service the starter. https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/ROVER-75-...0/252158920680 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 101 __________________ Arctic Givology Learn to Give Everything is Achievable ad altiora tendo. Check out our Nano meet dates http://www.midlandsnanomeets.co.uk/ http://www.the75andztclub.co.uk/index.php?thepage=howto " You do the work , we supply the expertise "

30th December 2020, 13:06	#5
Rogue I really should get out more....... 75 CDT SE 160 Saloon Join Date: May 2017 Location: Thorpe St Andrew, Norwich Posts: 2,650 Thanks: 1,386 Thanked 1,096 Times in 774 Posts	+1 for the starter motor solenoid being the issue. Is exactly how mine would behave before it was refurbished however you should still be able to hear it click once when you try and start it assuming it's not just a bad contact on the spade. __________________ Glutton for punishment --- Previously ... 2.6 SD1 x 2, 3.5 SD1, 820S, 820Si x2, 216 Gsi, 220T saloon, 414, 45 1.4 x2 and now a Cowley 75 CDT

30th December 2020, 20:33	#6
Yorkshire GOC I really should get out more....... Rover 75 connoisseur se v6 auto Join Date: May 2014 Location: Hull Posts: 2,063 Thanks: 1,842 Thanked 623 Times in 469 Posts	Sounds like the crank sensor to me - fails hot then cools down and works OK __________________ She came off the Longbridge Line on 20-05-2003 The Silver Machine was the 13th of 160 Rover 75's to come off the production line that day and is the 100th of 527 Starlight Silver Rover 75 2.5 V6 Connoisseur SE Auto saloons listed in the build records produced world wide.

30th December 2020, 12:03	#2
planenut Regional Secretary Rover 1.8T Tourer Join Date: May 2007 Location: Heathrow Posts: 6,954 Thanks: 1,551 Thanked 2,036 Times in 1,264 Posts	If everything appeared normal, could you hear anything? I.e. clicking from the engine area. Power problems seem to be accompanied by that. If there were no other indications, check and clean the connectors on the starter motor. Glad it got you home. I've had the embarrassment of recovery attending and car started immediately..

31st December 2020, 09:46	#8
Yorkshire GOC I really should get out more....... Rover 75 connoisseur se v6 auto Join Date: May 2014 Location: Hull Posts: 2,063 Thanks: 1,842 Thanked 623 Times in 469 Posts	Hi all I went out in the car yesterday and drove about 50 miles, parked up and went for a long walk. When I got back to the car, I sat in it for a few minutes while I had something to eat and drink and then it wouldn't start. Lights came on with the key as normal, but no starter. It was like having a key without the transponder. Tried a few times. Looked under the bonnet but didn't know what to look for. Made sure everything in the under bonnet fuse box was pushed in. Locked and unlocked car. Tried a few more times. No luck. Rang the recovery people. Had to walk down the road and look for name of street/church/pub. Then back to the car. Try it one more time and it started. I dared to switch it off and it started again, so I rang the recovery firm again to cancel the call out. The car got me home and started again this morning. Might be worth mentioning that a few weeks ago I undid the bottom of the inside fuse box and took the trim off the side of the tunnel so I could spray stuff into the recirculating inlet. The car was like this for a while and yesterday was the first day I drove it after putting it back together, although as I've said it worked fine on the outward journey. Now I'll be wondering if it'll start every time I go to drive it. I suspect there could be a dodgy connector somewhere. Any ideas where to check? Cheers Van Vantheman is offline Report Post Could be a failing crank sensor - if it happens again and you turn her over watch the rev counter - it it stays still and does not flicker then its the crank sensor. If the ECU at ignition does not receive the CPS signal it will not allow the car to start up - so no starter motor . __________________ She came off the Longbridge Line on 20-05-2003 The Silver Machine was the 13th of 160 Rover 75's to come off the production line that day and is the 100th of 527 Starlight Silver Rover 75 2.5 V6 Connoisseur SE Auto saloons listed in the build records produced world wide.

2nd January 2021, 18:50	#9
Vantheman Regular poster Rover 75 Saloon Join Date: Aug 2020 Location: Dorset/Hampshire border Posts: 55 Thanks: 27 Thanked 10 Times in 6 Posts	Thanks for all the replies and sorry I took a few days to get back. Having been moved into Tier 4 I'm not using the car until I go back to work on Monday so I held off looking at it during the coldest days. But I have tried to start it a few times over those days and it's been fine each time. I had a butchers at the connection to the solenoid and both parts were quite oxidised. Did take a photo but can't work out how to share it. Cleaned the contact on the solenoid with 240 wet or dry and fitted a new crimp to the lead. Reconnected and then smeared on some heavy waterproof grease. Now I just see if it happens again, but will probably arm myself with the rebuild kit. Thanks for the info and pics on this Arctic. You mentioned mileage - The car's done 100k, went up to this on the actual journey. Van