1.8t liners sunk, which head gasket?

[Stryder]

Thanks for all the replies! Still a little unsure though after being bombarded with even more info.
I spoke to an Mg specialist (who sold me the liner shims) and was told they use these shims all the time now instead of machining the block, paired with a Payen multi layer head gasket and they dont have any issues.
Just wanted to try an alternative to block machining. If this means it only lasts another 50k before I need to replace the gasket/shims again I have no issues with doing that. If it only last 50k and then its dead, at least ill have time to get another engine (I refuse to scrap a car this nice!)

I will have a proper measure up today and have to make my decision! I'll keep you all informed if you're interested.

Thanks for all the help btw, most useful forum I've come across

[marinabrian]

Originally Posted by Click4

Slightly low is different to sunk, sunk is caused by soft block, low is production tolerances. Lots of engines came out the factory low, but it was accepted because its not such a problem with elastomer gasket which was being fitted. Reason they failed was because the elastomer separated rather than low liners. MLS was introduced as a more reliable fix towards end of production and liner heights were more critical

Why didnt they just do it by using a surfacing machine or killing machine... Would of produced better result and taken half the time probably.

Can I ask on what authority you have it that the MLS was fitted towards the end of production?
I always took it to be that the MLS was never used in production K series cars, and this would seem to be borne out during investigative works carried out on late model cars
Brian

[SKS Disco]

Marinabrian is correct.
MLS was never fitted to any MG Rover during production.
It was designed for the EU4 engine which never made it to the track prior to closure.

I believe Powertrain did make some EU4 1.8 engines for Landrover though prior to closure.

[SD1too]

I understand that the cylinder head gasket covers the top horizontal surface of the liners. Is that correct? If so, how can the liners be proud, even by a few thou., of the head? MG Rover says that this can happen if the engine is rotated whilst the head is removed without liner clamps being fitted. I have also not been able to find any MG Rover data on liner protrusion.

So under what circumstances would the liners rise?

Simon

[Stryder]

Well it turns out the liners aren't as low as I first thought.



So maybe now I won't be fitting the liner shims. Still doesn't explain why the MLS gasket failed in the first place, unless it is just that one flush corner? The block doesnt appear to be warped (only checked with a straight edge bar) sending head for checks next.

[SD1too]

I've just read MG Rover's official procedure for refitting the liners. It says to apply sealant to the shoulder, then insert carefully without allowing them to fall into position. And that's all. Nothing about liner protrusion. This seems to suggest that if the liners do protrude slightly (as shown in the previous posting), it should be regarded as acceptable.

Simon

[Click4]

MLS was fitted to some land rover K series engines right at the end of production.

I as referring to engine production rather than mg rover production.

As MLS was something that was developed and finalised around the time of the collapse, then china and land rover went on to use it.

Mls can fail, which was why the revised head bolts and stiffer oil rail was also introduced and x part sell all 3 items as an expensive kit.

[marinabrian]

Originally Posted by Click4

MLS was fitted to some land rover K series engines right at the end of production.

I as referring to engine production rather than mg rover production.

As MLS was something that was developed and finalised around the time of the collapse, then china and land rover went on to use it.

Mls can fail, which was why the revised head bolts and stiffer oil rail was also introduced and x part sell all 3 items as an expensive kit.

No the MLS and oil rail was only ever available as a retrofit.
I have it on good authority, that the freelander 1 fitted with the 1800 k16 never had anything other than the elastomer gasket fitted in production
The N series engine as fitted to the MG6 and MG7 is what you may be thinking of......
Brian

[Click4]

Thanks for correcting me learn something new every day.

Wasn't N series I was thinking of, just read that the MLS and oil rail had been developed at the time of rover collapse, but never made it to an mg rover production engine, but thought some had started to be fitted to some land rover ones at the end of production. MLs that is, not the oil rail.

Now I know better lol thanks

[SKS Disco]

Original MLS with shim and oil rail was specified for EU4 spec K Series engines. Head bolts and torque settings remained the same for that one.
Powertrain Change order number for the EU4 engine was 029777 - created 07/01/2005

schedule was as follows.
Freelander and R75 N/A engines - week 14 - 2005
R25 and R45 80mm bore - week 17 - 2005
TF and all VVC - week 19 - 2005
R25 and R45 75mm bore - week 21 - 2005
Turbo - week 24 - 2005

As MGR went down about week 12, they never made it to production line fit