Coroner calls for review of Smart Motorways

[torque2me]

Originally Posted by macafee2

Not sure if it is the M42 but a smart motorway I use is a pain in the butt.
Hard shoulder open as a lane so I use it, then it becomes the exit for the next junction so I need to change lane. After the junction I'm back to using the hard shoulder only for it to become the exit for the next junction.

Should I lane hog and stick to the proper lane 1? Worse when towing the caravan

macafee2

Right on bro! Stick to lane 2 (as it will be now) but you will have to match or be moving slightly quicker than lane 1 (was hard shoulder) traffic.

Kev

[torque2me]

Originally Posted by FLYING BANANA

The amount of abuse the TEA and Police officers got from passing motorists was unbelievable. But they said it was the norm.

Funny how impatient people have become over the last 20 or so years. A few minutes on their journey time and they fume. I was always taught to put extra time into any journey undertaken to help alleviate hold-ups!

Those same intolerant motorists, I would hazard to guess, totally expect everyone to understand the difficulties when they breakdown.

Kev

[torque2me]

Originally Posted by Bolin

Done.

A few months back I was driving east on the M3 in the left lane (what used to be the hard shoulder), following a lorry.

I was getting closer to the lorry, to the point whee I was about to pull into the next lane to overtake, when the lorry very suddenly moved into that lane.

Which suddenly left me with a broken down car in the live lane not far ahead at all - thankfully there was nothing in the next lane so I too could pull over but it was far too close for comfort.

And what would have happened if the motorway was really busy? Slam on the brakes and hope for a gap in the next lane and hope not to get hit by a vehicle behind?

And just what the hell should you do if you break down in a live lane with a passenger in a wheelchair in the car? They can't just jump out of the car and leap to safety over the barrier in a few seconds.......

That is one of the main issues with regard to non-hard shoulder motorways. If the next lane has a high volume of vehicles in it (particularly of HGV's) which need their safe stopping space preserved then you're put into a dangerous situation!

The elite are not bothered about the sorrows impacted on the family survivors but funnily enough talk a good game in the electioneering weeks.

Kev

[Avulon]

Originally Posted by Rick-sta

all it takes is a lorry or large vehicle which blocks your view of the traffic ahead to move out of the 1st lane into the 2nd to avoid a stranded vehicle too late. Even if you're following the lorry at a safe distance with adequate braking distance between yourself and the lorry, if the lorry moves over too late by the time it's trailer is out of the way of your view you're now right up behind the stranded vehicle, the stopping distance by that point would be too short, and add on reaction time you may end up too close to even avoid the stranded vehicle by changing lanes. Can happen to anyone, no one expects to see a stranded vehicle in a live lane of a motorway when the rest of the traffic is flowing at 70mph.

Not only would such situation be life changing for the stranded vehicle if the occupants are still in it, I feel for the driver who collides into the stranded vehicle. In a split second whilst driving perfectly safely you could end up in a situation where you've seriously injured someone or even killed someone, and your own fate could be the same. And if you survive the collision, you'd most likely be faced with a conviction for dangerous driving (as there's never such thing as a accident anymore, someone always has to be convicted) and even a prison sentence if someone is killed.

You don't have to be a bad or dangerous driver for this to happen to you, wrong place wrong time or a split second looking at your mirrors or focusing on one of the other cars around you and this can happen.

A great point to demonstrate that as a driver you must absolutely not assume anything. And that driving where your view ahead is insufficient should be avoided at all costs. let me put it this way. If the (theoretical) lorry in front of you pulled an emergency stop (maybe partially aided by hitting an obstruction you can't see) could you stop in time? If the answer is 'probably not' then regardless of how big a gap between you and the lorry it's not enough. If you apply this thinking when unavoidably stuck behind a vehicle that blocks your view ahead, I'll promise you that you'll increase that gap to a point where if you ask yourself 'if the lorry infront swerves to avoid a broken down vehicle can I stop or swerve in time?' your answer to that will be 'yes'. Driving on motorways is a constant seeking of an empty bubble to drive in with clear view, especially forward. Not following x feet/metres behind any vehicle that blocks your view.



TLR - If you can't stop in the space between you and the vehicle in front obstructing your view then you're too close.

[coolguy]

Originally Posted by Avulon

A great point to demonstrate that as a driver you must absolutely not assume anything. And that driving where your view ahead is insufficient should be avoided at all costs. let me put it this way. If the (theoretical) lorry in front of you pulled an emergency stop (maybe partially aided by hitting an obstruction you can't see) could you stop in time? If the answer is 'probably not' then regardless of how big a gap between you and the lorry it's not enough. If you apply this thinking when unavoidably stuck behind a vehicle that blocks your view ahead, I'll promise you that you'll increase that gap to a point where if you ask yourself 'if the lorry infront swerves to avoid a broken down vehicle can I stop or swerve in time?' your answer to that will be 'yes'. Driving on motorways is a constant seeking of an empty bubble to drive in with clear view, especially forward. Not following x feet/metres behind any vehicle that blocks your view.



TLR - If you can't stop in the space between you and the vehicle in front obstructing your view then you're too close.

Quite agree, BUT how many times do you find the gap filled , or a tailgater pushing you to close the gap when you drop back.

[wraymond]

If I get a tailgater I use the rear window blind. If that doesn't do the job, the hazards go on. If that doesn't do it, I drop 2 mph. (I also have an old Viking mascot from a P4. I'm tempted to drill the eyes and install red led's and a switch. The rear facing shelf would be used). When the tailgater finally overtakes, he is treated to a wide smile.

[Avulon]

Originally Posted by coolguy

Quite agree, BUT how many times do you find the gap filled , or a tailgater pushing you to close the gap when you drop back.

Well that's driving on busy roads for you. You have to always actively seek the space you need to be safe and drive defensively. You can't usually just choose a distance behind something and sit there for mile upon mile. Eventually something will change. Something behind, something coming into the gap between you and the vehicle in front, the vehicle in front changing speed or lane. Driving is constant effort: never let yourself believe otherwise.

[coolguy]

[QUOTE=Avulon;2871691. Driving is constant effort: never let yourself believe otherwise.[/QUOTE]

Only because nearly everyone else is an idiot !

[planenut]

Originally Posted by coolguy

Only because nearly everyone else is an idiot !

For years, that is the advice I have give both learners and qualified drivers, treat everybody as an idiot.

[Dorset Bob]

Originally Posted by cat

Done.
Please update us on the results if possible.

Here are the results, copied and pasted, for anyone who is interested:-

Smart Motorways survey results

Over 4,700 responses were received to our recent survey on smart motorways. Most respondents had already used them, so their comments and votes are very useful. The opinions expressed were overwhelmingly negative.

81% felt less safe on a smart motorway and the same number wanted the hard shoulder to be reinstated immediately. 85% supported the stopping of the building of any more smart motorways until the safety case is proven. Alarmingly 85% said that they would not trust the technology to protect them if they ever broke down in a live lane of a smart motorway. The vast majority also supported more frequent safety refuges or going back to a continuous hard shoulder. Slightly more positively, one in five IAM RoadSmart Members had seen some improvement in congestion because of smart motorways, and just over half felt that they knew what to do in the event of a breakdown.

Neil Greig has already shared some of these findings at a major safety conference which was addressed by Road Safety Minister, Baroness Vere, and senior people from Highways England. The findings will also be formed into a strong call to action in our response to the House of Commons Transport Committee inquiry that ends soon. Many thanks to all of you who took the time to respond. Such an overwhelming response from a group of drivers who are confident and knowledgeable about motorways gives us a really strong message to take back to the government.