Rover 75(1.8) Broke down on M5-no water in engine-is the car now scrap?

[Ducati750cc]

Originally Posted by hogweed

Used to happen on the original GPZ900R... I had a much-loved example back in 1984/5 which destroyed its top end from overheating, with the temp gauge reading fine... coolant system was almost empty

Tut, tut, you should have known when your knees started getting hot, now with my air cooled bikes it was never a problem, nuts and bolts dropping off, bulb filaments breaking with vibration, the odd bearing going on the old Atlas etc. its saving grace was that on bitterly cold winters days I could lean forward and both warm my hands and turn my leather gloves to cardboard on the pipes.



Ahh the good old days.

[skellum]

Hi Andy. You've been unlucky, but you aren't alone. Our youngest lad called me from work a couple of months back. His Mazda 6 'sounded funny'. It certainly did, like someone had put a bag of spanners in the tumble drier. Turned out there wasn't a drop of oil in the car. It's now dead, as the car had too much rot to justify changing the engine.
Best of luck getting your own car back on the road and if you do, this place if full of good advice to keep her going. Cheers!

[BigRuss]

As Trikey said above if it's been overheated to the point that the plastics on the engine have melted then there's a very high chance that the liners have dropped.

If they've dropped too much then it's no good just putting a new head gasket on because it will soon fail.
If they have dropped too much then the only way is to remove and reseat the liners to the correct height.
If the liner heights are ok make sure the valves seats are reground otherwise you'll suffer poor compression and a misfire

Temperature sender's can fail in that they badly under-read the temperature, I've see it where it's started venting boiling water from the radiator cap despite the car reading less than 88°C and the fan didn't come on

Russ

[COLVERT]

Word of warning Mr Bilston.

If before you do any work on the engine be aware that if there's a leak in the head gasket any water you put in it could leak into a cylinder and fill it.--If you spin the engine over on the starter it's possible smash a piston or bent a con rod.


Therefore make sure you've turned the engine over a couple of times by hand.----If it wont turn around this will tell you that one of the bores is full of water.--------This subtle hint from your engine means STOP>----

[Ducati750cc]

Originally Posted by COLVERT

Word of warning Mr Bilston.

If before you do any work on the engine be aware that if there's a leak in the head gasket any water you put in it could leak into a cylinder and fill it.--If you spin the engine over on the starter it's possible smash a piston or bent a con rod.


Therefore make sure you've turned the engine over a couple of times by hand.----If it wont turn around this will tell you that one of the bores is full of water.--------This subtle hint from your engine means STOP>----

Simply turn it over with the plugs out with ignition disabled, and stand back, if no fountains of water out of the bore, then either pop the plugs back in and see if it will start and proceed from there.


Ideally though, if no water in the bores, doing a cylinder leak down test will give plenty of information as to head gasket or other problems, similarly a compression and coolant system test will provide info but not as comprehensive as a leak down test.



Contrary to popular belief, the chance of bending a rod or piston damage whilst cranking ( 200-300 rpm. average ) an engine over with a bore full of water is very low, the starter motor is incapable of providing the energy to do so.


On the other hand, driving through a flood with water entering the bores via the air intake system will in many cases, but not always, cause damage, dependant on the engine speed at the time, oddly enough the engine size and the inertia available from all the rotating components.


Over the years on both land vehicle engines and boat engines I've seen damage, due to water ingress with a running engine, ranging from none, through bent rods, to the cylinder head being pushed up off the block, the best one was on a Ford truck where the driver thought it would be great to fly through a section of flooded road to splash passers by, till there was a sudden clunk, cab tilted to see oil running down from the cyl head joint through an approx 4mm gap, a few grand and weeks later it was back on the road with another driver.

[COLVERT]

Rather than---inertia available, perhaps Kinetic Energy available.--------

[andybilston]

Thanks for advice about not starting the engine after adding water.
I've not had any time to look at car properly yet but I did add some water on Friday just to see if there was any left in the system and put about 4 litres in and I think it is not up to full mark yet. I did not attempt to start car but there is some water in the system now-will that be a problem or is it ok as long as I don't try and start car?
I spoke to the mechanic who put the temperature sensor in and he said if it was a head gasket the cost of repair would be around £750 plus more if further damage was done but I would need to get it towed in to him first-something I wont be doing as I'm not confident in his ability to do a good job on a head gasket.
I am not mechanically minded at all so wouldn't even try to start it by taking plugs etc out.
My only real choice is to scrap the car or get Russell Walsh (mobile repair) to look at it in about a months time and pay £425/£775 depending on what damage is done and then have a car with a good reliable engine in as all normal garages where I am are going to charge a high price with no guarantee that the job has been done properly.

[planenut]

Andy, there are other experts closer to you and you should get one of them to give it a once over before committing to a more expensive, maybe unnecessary option.

[andybilston]

I spoke to Summit Dudley (about 5 miles from me) who are highly recommended on here but I would still need to get it towed to them and they said they would need to dismantle to give a diagnosis costing £200 or more plus towing and then towing back again and then I would have a partly dismantled engine, a diagnosis and would have spent about £300 with no work being done as if was a headgasket there costs to do work would be too high, hence my possible reasoning of using a mobile service where the standard of work would still be as high but far more affordable?

[planenut]

Originally Posted by andybilston

I spoke to Summit Dudley (about 5 miles from me) who are highly recommended on here but I would still need to get it towed to them and they said they would need to dismantle to give a diagnosis costing £200 or more plus towing and then towing back again and then I would have a partly dismantled engine, a diagnosis and would have spent about £300 with no work being done as if was a headgasket there costs to do work would be too high, hence my possible reasoning of using a mobile service where the standard of work would still be as high but far more affordable?

I'm no expert, as some on here would agree with, but there are several of our members who could give you a good diagnosis without dismantling.