Broke down yesterday - fuel problem

Mr bountyfull · 15th July 2017, 14:33

Hello folks

I bought the car in question 26/12/16 and just over 20000 miles later I found myself broken down. Luckly I was just a few miles (M6 Northbound 2 miles from J39 Shap) from home and the weather was fine.

I had just noticed a small bump and then a loss of power so drifted to the hard shoulder. I called the AA who were there in less than 30 minutes. I knew it was a fuel issue as I could still crank the engine over. The fuel gauge was indicating around 1/4 and the distance to empty displayed over 100 miles.

The AA man checked for fuel coming through with me cranking the engine over and only air. He stuck 5ltrs in and it fired up after a few cranks. So today after adding another 10ltrs I drove to the nearest station and brimmed the tank. It took just 34ltrs. This more or less makes the 100 mile range seem accurate so it would appear the final 2ltrs cannot be lifted by the in tank pump.

So finally the question is could this be a need for the yellow fuel pump clip or other?

T-Cut · 15th July 2017, 16:31

A late V8 (assume this is what we're talking about) will suffer from Fuel Filter Syndrome (FFS) unless it has the Fabled Orange Clip (FOC) in position. That may not be your problem, but fit a FOC anyway. One thing less to go wrong. The pump should 'suck' whatever's in the tank, but 2 litres to dry is pressing it a bit.

A full tank contains 64 litres.

TC

Mr bountyfull · 15th July 2017, 16:41

No sorry its not my V8 which has the clip fitted its my 2001 CDTi. Is it the same clip?

roverbarmy · 15th July 2017, 16:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr bountyfull

No sorry its not my V8 which has the clip fitted its my 2001 CDTi. Is it the same clip?

If it's the CDTI with the problem, it will be a fuel pump problem. The 1/4 tank of fuel syndrome is well documented elsewhere on the forum. Do a search for underbonnet pump for more details as I am no expert on the diesels but have read of these symptoms before.

T-Cut · 15th July 2017, 20:44

OK, diesels may have two fuel pumps (one under the bonnet) or a single in-tank pump. The single (in-tank) pump system will fail to start if the pump has failed. On the other hand, the dual pump system can run fairly happily on the under-bonnet pump alone. However, due to the design of the ITP, it (the UBP) will suck air into the line if the tank contents get too low (the said quarter tank syndrome). Topping up the fuel level usully gets things going. Eventually the UBP is likely to fail though being over-stressed. Do you have an under-bonnet pump?

TC

SD1too · 15th July 2017, 21:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr bountyfull

No sorry its not my V8 which has the clip fitted its my 2001 CDTi.

Stephen, please update your profile to include your diesel. It is not fair to members trying to help you when the vehicle details are misleading.

Simon

Edit: Thanks very much!

Mr bountyfull · 15th July 2017, 21:49

Will check tomorrow. This is my third CDTi so have seen the pump problems before with the ITP and the Tube low pressure pump failing in sequence before.

Mr bountyfull · 16th July 2017, 14:27

I could hear the ITP pumping when listening through open fuel filler so I suspect FFS. I have ordered the now white clip

(http://www.allcarpartsfast.co.uk/mg-...jc000230-clip/ )

and will have a go next weekend.

Mike Noc · 16th July 2017, 15:11

Don't waste too much time looking for an in tank fuel filter on the diesel, and don't waste money on a clip.

If the ITP is running then it sounds like you have a problem with the pipework in the tank, and air is getting into the circuit when the level is low.

Just to double check, whip the plug off the top of the UBP and then listen again at the open filler cap.

15th July 2017, 14:33	#1
Mr bountyfull Gets stuck in MGZTV8 Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Newbury Posts: 567 Thanks: 173 Thanked 82 Times in 58 Posts	Broke down yesterday - fuel problem Hello folks I bought the car in question 26/12/16 and just over 20000 miles later I found myself broken down. Luckly I was just a few miles (M6 Northbound 2 miles from J39 Shap) from home and the weather was fine. I had just noticed a small bump and then a loss of power so drifted to the hard shoulder. I called the AA who were there in less than 30 minutes. I knew it was a fuel issue as I could still crank the engine over. The fuel gauge was indicating around 1/4 and the distance to empty displayed over 100 miles. The AA man checked for fuel coming through with me cranking the engine over and only air. He stuck 5ltrs in and it fired up after a few cranks. So today after adding another 10ltrs I drove to the nearest station and brimmed the tank. It took just 34ltrs. This more or less makes the 100 mile range seem accurate so it would appear the final 2ltrs cannot be lifted by the in tank pump. So finally the question is could this be a need for the yellow fuel pump clip or other?

16th July 2017, 15:11	#9
Mike Noc This is my second home Rover 75 CDT Manual Connoisseur SE, Rover 75 CDT Automatic Connoisseur SE & a Freelander Td4. Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Hampshire Posts: 11,547 Thanks: 3,470 Thanked 3,119 Times in 2,247 Posts	Don't waste too much time looking for an in tank fuel filter on the diesel, and don't waste money on a clip. If the ITP is running then it sounds like you have a problem with the pipework in the tank, and air is getting into the circuit when the level is low. Just to double check, whip the plug off the top of the UBP and then listen again at the open filler cap. Last edited by Mike Noc; 16th July 2017 at 15:14..

15th July 2017, 16:31	#2
T-Cut This is my second home Rover75 and Mreg Corsa. Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Sumweer onat mote o'dust (Sagin) Posts: 21,752 Thanks: 341 Thanked 3,660 Times in 2,924 Posts	A late V8 (assume this is what we're talking about) will suffer from Fuel Filter Syndrome (FFS) unless it has the Fabled Orange Clip (FOC) in position. That may not be your problem, but fit a FOC anyway. One thing less to go wrong. The pump should 'suck' whatever's in the tank, but 2 litres to dry is pressing it a bit. A full tank contains 64 litres. TC

15th July 2017, 16:41	#3
Mr bountyfull Gets stuck in MGZTV8 Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Newbury Posts: 567 Thanks: 173 Thanked 82 Times in 58 Posts	No sorry its not my V8 which has the clip fitted its my 2001 CDTi. Is it the same clip?

15th July 2017, 20:44	#5
T-Cut This is my second home Rover75 and Mreg Corsa. Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Sumweer onat mote o'dust (Sagin) Posts: 21,752 Thanks: 341 Thanked 3,660 Times in 2,924 Posts	OK, diesels may have two fuel pumps (one under the bonnet) or a single in-tank pump. The single (in-tank) pump system will fail to start if the pump has failed. On the other hand, the dual pump system can run fairly happily on the under-bonnet pump alone. However, due to the design of the ITP, it (the UBP) will suck air into the line if the tank contents get too low (the said quarter tank syndrome). Topping up the fuel level usully gets things going. Eventually the UBP is likely to fail though being over-stressed. Do you have an under-bonnet pump? TC

15th July 2017, 21:49	#7
Mr bountyfull Gets stuck in MGZTV8 Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Newbury Posts: 567 Thanks: 173 Thanked 82 Times in 58 Posts	Will check tomorrow. This is my third CDTi so have seen the pump problems before with the ITP and the Tube low pressure pump failing in sequence before.

16th July 2017, 14:27	#8
Mr bountyfull Gets stuck in MGZTV8 Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Newbury Posts: 567 Thanks: 173 Thanked 82 Times in 58 Posts	I could hear the ITP pumping when listening through open fuel filler so I suspect FFS. I have ordered the now white clip (http://www.allcarpartsfast.co.uk/mg-...jc000230-clip/ ) and will have a go next weekend.