Curtailing Pensioner Benefits

[breakfastinsmethwick]

Many on here speak of work ethic. An elderly gent here had a a small hardware store and ran newspaper deliveries to help it pay. Always helpful and attentive.

He developed cancer but carried on regardless. I was humbled to see him delivering papers at 05:00 on winter mornings, barely shuffling along from his car to the door of his customer. He had to close the business in the end.

He was a proper geezer, and much missed.

[MSS]

Originally Posted by macafee2

alas no it was not, I was simply pointing out to those with firm opinions that it is not an easy yes/no answer.

Should the oap that has only their state pension get the same benefits as the OAP that is a multi millionaire? The latter not needing the state pension or benefits but may have paid a lot more tax then the other OAP. The other OAP may have spent all their money on what ever and saved nothing for the future leaving it to the state to look after them.

Not everyone has had a job where they could save or have a pension.

whilst I am reluctant to say it should be means tested, this may be a way to go.

There are people that have "never" worked and scrounged off the state even though they are fit for work and choose not to, should they get a pension and benefits? Before anyone says no, answer this, are you going to let them starve? That would be inappropriate.

everyone should work for their £ if able. If it can not be employment by a company then the state finds them work, even if it is cleaning the streets, making them parking wardens. No one fit to work should get money for nothing. There will be exceptions, carers, sick, disabled.

The deserving should keep the benefits but who decides on who is deserving?

macafee2

1. Whether a millionaire gets a pension or not in irrelevant other than for its emotional value given the small numbers involved.

2. In my doctrine, all those who have reached the pension age will receive the pension.

3. We cannot change the past, but the proposed doctrine will create a better, fairer society for future generations because all those who are alive will work as a basic duty that earns the right to live.

4. I am inclined to take on board Wraymond's thinking and include castration in some form for specific scenarios - will give this further thought during the afternoon.

[macafee2]

I think I'll be pushing up daises before we see any money. My anticipation is that we will lose more money. I know it does not make financial sense but then some things don't, they are just the "right" thing to do.

There can also I understand, be stamp duty implications when it comes to owning more then 1 property making it even harder for landlords to buy to rent.

Houses to rent is more my daughters kind of thing.

macafee2

[jackatesme]

I started work one week before my 15th birthday,and worked until i was 63,i only had a break of 2 weeks between jobs in that 48 yrs.
Since retiring,we found it difficult to pay the full rent from our basic pensions,we were told to get in touch with age concern. They put in a claim for my wife,and now receive some benefits,so we now have a comfortable life.
The lady who helped us told us not to be embarrassed about claiming,has we had both worked all our lives. She added that the Goverment not only had a pot of money from the people working and paying taxes they also had a pot of money from people who paid taxes but did not live long enough to get their pension.
On a lighter note,if they take money off me,to give to my 3 g/children then there will be no more free Sunday Lunches.

[HarryM1BYT]

Originally Posted by macafee2

There are people that have "never" worked and scrounged off the state even though they are fit for work and choose not to, should they get a pension and benefits? Before anyone says no, answer this, are you going to let them starve? That would be inappropriate.

I have paid lots into the system, but my pension is really not much better than someone who has paid nowt in, but rather has spent their life scrounging. I have to pay in full for everything, those who are means tested get such a lot for free - that simply cannot be right.


Anyone who has made a lifestyle choice not to work, should not be allowed to starve, that would be wrong, but nor should they be entitled to a life of ease and luxury as we have at the moment.



I always remember the poor guy who lived across the road from us when I was a youngster. He was crippled, obviously didn't have much income, never had any heating, couldn't afford electric lighting, so used a tiny paraffin lamp, he could not even afford to feed himself properly - I didn't understand at the time, I was too young, but he would have me nip to the shop to get him 2oz of cheese.



That is the other extreme and we don't want to go there, neither do we want the workshy living as good and comfortable a life as those who have spent their lives working hard - there has to be a worthwhile differential or we might as well all just spend our lives sitting on our backsides.

[baxlin]

Originally Posted by Brit

When I retired 15 years ago I no longer paid National Insurance, no longer had the cost of commuting to work, no need for smart work clothing. I no longer had to buy lunch out. I no longer contributed to a pension scheme. These all added up to a material saving. I love retirement.

Don’t get me wrong, I love retirement, it’s the best job I’ve ever had!

Each of us is different, I stopped paying NI at 65, but didn’t retire until 69. In the meantime, I took my State Pension, and reduced my salary by the combination of personal NI and State Pension, which saved my company NI on the reduction, and kept my net pay the same as before. Both savings were then put into a Personal Pension by my company.

I’ll give you the savings on business attire, though, Mrs B had already pointed out that I’d only bought a casual jacket and a couple of pairs of Chinos since I retired.

[steve-45]

It will be a VERY BRAVE government that tries to cut pensioners benefits.

They may be old, but they still get off their bums to vote - unlike many younger people who seem to be permanently glued to their phones !

[mileshawk56]

My wife and are pensioners, oh and I wont go on about working all our lives from 15yoage on wards to state pension age etc etc. But I will say we are not wealthy pensioners-only just dont qualify for any other benefit than pension so work that out. Another but- I didn't ask for the winter fuel allowance and I think it should be means tested as should the "free" TV licence both of these were pure vote catchers, and if I don't get it so be it. And another devisive and stupid idea from the braindead politico's but whats new? Chris.S.

[wraymond]

It's true there are anomalies and many things seem needlessly offered to seemingly unworthy recipients. It's hard to avoid judgmental decisions when we don't know all the circumstances.

However, there can't be many families claiming benefit that haven't got one or more PC's in the house. Plus phones as they are of course essential. Apart from buying them in the first place, that implies broadband as a minimum and TV maybe combined. So Sky, plus (of course) Sport and phone calls included. How much is that? Enough to avoid having to go to food banks maybe?

I was in Tesco early yesterday morning, buying my paper. In front of me was an elderly man, a pensioner, as usual leaning with both arms on the trolley handle and coughing. I thought 'Poor old chap, what a struggle it must be'. He bought fags for £240, 8 lottery tickets and two bottles of wine. When I was being served I must have looked surprised because the cashier said 'Yes, he buys the same every Saturday'. No matter what the circumstances there is a vast amount of over-indulgence going on at somebody else's expense.

Am I curmudgeonly? No more than being able to criticise degrees for 'Media Studies' and 'Traditional Dance' or 'Theoretical Literacy' for so called students whose primary objective is to find themselves. Heck, they can't even rant.

[jackatesme]

To rely on benefits or not to rely on benefits. It could depend on what part of the country you have lived and worked all your life. I have worked in S Wales all my life and when i read what the average wage in the U.K.is, it is regarded as a joke around these parts. I have many times heard stories about people retiring selling their houses and down sizing to a far cheaper house in less affluent but nicer areas.Then living off the profit of the sale.As the average price of a house here is 60/70 thousand,i can't see many people here doing the same.
I was offered a job in Northampton in the sixties doing the same job i had here for double the wages.It would mean i would have to move to England,but as a young patriotic Welshman i found that was a no go.