URGENT MG ZTt Clutch bleeding

[JohnnyBG]

My garage has replaced clutch and slave with parts from Rimmer's, master cylinder with DMGRS left hand master.

They grumbled about swapping pipes for master but all good on that and they say they kept fluid in the master. They can't get pressure.

Apparently tried traditional, pressure and reverse bleeding. Say that with the quick releas connector off, no master pressure. They put the old master back on, just the same result.

I'm away from home, had to take wife to a meeting, and will be calling in at the garage latter this pm. They keep saying their training was not to tamper, River clutch a one shot system. To be fair, they did the 75 I still have and all was good. Scott at DMGRS has been great with this by the way offering advice .

I'm tempted to get it to home and try and sort it myself!

HELP

JohnnyBG

[macafee2]

Check master has fluid in and has not leaked out where the pipe to master join is.

Could a connector with a bleed nipple be fitted to the clutch side of the quick fit connector? This is to eliminate the slave.
If when pressing the clutch pedal down no fluid comes out of the bleed nipple and a decent attempt at bleeding has been made, the master may have failed.
An internal seal may have failed allowing fluid to by pass the seal and stay in the master cylinder. I would have thought the master was ok as your old master has the same problem. What made you have the clutch changed

How much fluid did the garage pass through the hydraulic system?


macafee2

[JohnnyBG]

Thanks a lot for the response. Taking each point in turn:

There's been no loss of fluid (except minor spillage);

I'm assured that the new and old master cylinders had fluid in - they were not allowed to be operated "dry";

Could a connector with a bleed nipple be fitted to the clutch side of the quick fit connector? I don't know.

If when pressing the clutch pedal down no fluid comes out of the bleed nipple and a decent attempt at bleeding has been made, the master may have failed. I don't know on this, the only remark made was that it was only sucking air

An internal seal may have failed allowing fluid to by pass the seal and stay in the master cylinder. It's new, from DMGRS, and as not allowed to operate "dry" should be fine?

What made you have the clutch changed? The hydraulics appeared to be operating fine, once gear was engaged the bite point was just above the middle of pedal travel, but the gear engagement was very difficult sometimes and reverse only possible after engaging first and then going back to reverse. There were no untoward gearbox noises and the garage said the the clutch they took out was completely shot, it was a rushed visit and I didn't take the offer to see the old clutch. They are entirely honest.

How much fluid did the garage pass through the hydraulic system? I didn't ask the question.

Slave is new from Rimmers and there is no fluid loss anywhere along the system.

They didn't try vacuum approach. I will arrange uplift to my lock up (car doesn't go in, only motorcycles as shutters to narrow) and will try to check the new master cylinder before taking out the old one and fitting the new one. I'll start from scratch, old fashioned approach, then reverse bleed and then vacuum.

Thanks again. If anyone on Teesside has experience of this, I'd be pleased to see you when I get the MG back!

As an aside, the Rover 75 Connie Tourer should be done before ever so long. The Alhambra is a noisy so and so but is still working apart from occasional turbo problem (probably a sensor).

PS - As a further thought, are there any old still original Rover garages on Teesside that might be able to sort this for me?

Johnny BG

[Ducati750cc]

Before stripping everything down, I would try doing a reverse reverse bleed again, taking care to do it properly and ensuring that it is filling the master cylinder, with a new slave and master this should be easily achieved and would prove out the pipework.


If fluid is passing from the slave bleed nipple, through the slave to the master OK, i.e. the whole system is full of fluid and free of air, still no pressure felt when the pedal is depressed, then the fault can only be the master, and, or slave !

[patrolman pete]

Originally Posted by JohnnyBG

Thanks a lot for the response. Taking each point in turn:

There's been no loss of fluid (except minor spillage);

I'm assured that the new and old master cylinders had fluid in - they were not allowed to be operated "dry";

Could a connector with a bleed nipple be fitted to the clutch side of the quick fit connector? I don't know.

If when pressing the clutch pedal down no fluid comes out of the bleed nipple and a decent attempt at bleeding has been made, the master may have failed. I don't know on this, the only remark made was that it was only sucking air

An internal seal may have failed allowing fluid to by pass the seal and stay in the master cylinder. It's new, from DMGRS, and as not allowed to operate "dry" should be fine?

What made you have the clutch changed? The hydraulics appeared to be operating fine, once gear was engaged the bite point was just above the middle of pedal travel, but the gear engagement was very difficult sometimes and reverse only possible after engaging first and then going back to reverse. There were no untoward gearbox noises and the garage said the the clutch they took out was completely shot, it was a rushed visit and I didn't take the offer to see the old clutch. They are entirely honest.

How much fluid did the garage pass through the hydraulic system? I didn't ask the question.

Slave is new from Rimmers and there is no fluid loss anywhere along the system.

They didn't try vacuum approach. I will arrange uplift to my lock up (car doesn't go in, only motorcycles as shutters to narrow) and will try to check the new master cylinder before taking out the old one and fitting the new one. I'll start from scratch, old fashioned approach, then reverse bleed and then vacuum.

Thanks again. If anyone on Teesside has experience of this, I'd be pleased to see you when I get the MG back!

As an aside, the Rover 75 Connie Tourer should be done before ever so long. The Alhambra is a noisy so and so but is still working apart from occasional turbo problem (probably a sensor).

PS - As a further thought, are there any old still original Rover garages on Teesside that might be able to sort this for me?

Johnny BG

Apart from Rovertec in Stockton who I haven't any experience of , I bought my first 75 from Reg Vardy in Stockton who are now a Citroen dealer. However that was back in 2001 and their Rover technicians would be long gone now I'd assume.

When I had my clutch changed by a local garage a few years back they were hopeless , misdiagnosing a faulty master cylinder twice before changing the slave and handed the car back to me with the pedal nearly on the floor . I played hell with them again and got it back only slightly better.

I took it home, attached an old eazy bleed kit and had a good pedal in 5 mins that is still good today.

I dread the thought of using a garage for repair apart from Dave Johnson up here near Fencehouses , who looks after a few members cars on here but he is so popular you have to book well in advance.

[JohnnyBG]

Thanks for the replies and I'll take notice. The only thing I planned to do before trying to bleed the system was to put the new master cylinder back in. The garage had refitted the old master cylinder as a test (it was working before the new clutch went in).

I think they thought the new master might be faulty. I doubt that is the case but they were not happy about swapping the pipes over to use the old pipes on the new master in the first place. The new one is one of the "left hand drive" masters from DMGRS and is identical in every way to the old one and Scott at DMGRS has done his very best to help. I hope that the multiple pipe swapping won't be a problem.

I'll have to look up how to separate the "quick" connector.

I bought new master as the 75 CDTI Connie Tourer clutch and original hydraulics failed at about 110k and the ZTT is at 103k. Replacing the slave was, of course, a no brainer and I doubt if the new slave will have been damaged or the problem. I was thinking to forestall problems!!!!

JohnnyBG

PS - I'll have to get the ZTT the three miles back home yet so nothing's happening quickly.

[JohnnyBG]

Hi All,

Firstly, thanks for the helpful responses. I had ordered a nice new non-return valve bleeding kit (would still have it in the jam jar with hydraulic fluid) and some 50ml syringes.

Then the owner of the garage called to say he'd done the job himself and all good - which it was! He said it took an hour but the secret was to work slowly and use a vacuum pump.

So now only the A/C to sort out but at the moment it'll be more important to research on here about the FBH. Never had one before.

Also be good to know how to hook up the audio controls to the radio (non standard one) as at the moment they just make a squelch noise through the speakers.

If I get stuck I'm sure there'll be a "How to" or friendly response from someone if I post asking for help.

Johnny BG