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Old 11th May 2017, 08:24   #11
EastPete
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Originally Posted by bigblue75 View Post
Filled the eesibleed and set up to bleed the clutch circuit from master to nipple. Spare tyre was at 16 p.s.i., tube into empty fluid container attached to nipple and my better half keeping tabs on the outflow...

The fluid didn't come out as steadily as previously from master to quick coupler but did run clear long before the (approx) 500ml had been fed into the master.

Stopped the fill by folding the tube from the eesibleed back on itself, tightened the nipple, topped up the master and then tidied the tools, rags, spare and torch away.
The fluid that I bled from the slave was not as cloudy or dull as previously but did look dirty. I noticed what looked like a circular bit of debris about 4mm across and I dipped in my index finger to pick it out so as to get a better look. It stuck to my fingertip and as I went to roll it between two fingers it dissolved at the slightest touch. I have no idea what it was, it looked dark grey to my eye.

Took her out for a run and biting point is around 40 mm from the bottom of the pedal and it seems like the top 20 mm of travel does nothing. before the bleed the biting point was the floor and the top 40 mm of pedal travel did nothing.

Not sure if another bleed through in around a month would do anything useful. Realise that it could be tomorrow, next week or next month when the clutch gives up the ghost... Maybe it would help prolong the life of the clutch to treat the flushing through as a 12000 mile service item?
Glad that the bleed seems to have improved things. I normally run the Eezibleed at about 20-22 psi to help push the fluid through. Also, you do not need to fold the Eezibleed tube to stop the fill - in fact you want the system under pressure when you close the bleed nipple to avoid any tiny air bubbles getting sucked in at the nipple thread before you tighten it.

The dirty appearance to the fluid coming out of the slave may be due to the grey grease that is used on the slave seal - the 4mm ring of 'debris' that dissolved easily between your fingers may have been a blob of grease that was stuck to the bleed nipple pipe/nipple. I do wonder if flushing or bleeding the clutch too excessively or too frequently could actually be removing the important grease that keep the seals working and in good condition !.

Some folks report a further improvement at the pedal by doing the reverse bleed from the nipple end - however, it is quite easy to introduce an air bubble when doing this, so I only attempt it using quite a large syringe (at least 50 mLs), and making sure I push at least 50 mLs fluid through to the master reservoir. 50 mls is about the capacity of the whole system, so by pushing this amount through, you should purge any air bubbles. I did not notice much improvement at the pedal when I tried this on my car, so I think a good Eezibleed should work for most cars.

Keep us posted - BTW - what make of clutch/ clutch master cylinder do you have fitted to your car ?

Pete
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Old 11th May 2017, 09:39   #12
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Hi Pete ,you can't do a reverse bleeding with the OEM master ...the little non
return valve prevent it (normaly )

Mike
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Old 11th May 2017, 10:13   #13
EastPete
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Hi Pete ,you can't do a reverse bleeding with the OEM master ...the little non
return valve prevent it (normaly )

Mike
Thanks Mike

I have the Tazu master on my car, as you probably know. I thought I saw something posted on here (Delphi technical bulletin ?) saying you can reverse bleed the pre-filled masters - perhaps someone who has attempted it can provide feedback.

My clutch is still good after 1500 miles, but I have noticed the gear change is not as slick since I fitted the HEL hydraulic hose in place of the copper pipe. This hose is quite long (88 cm), so probably 'gives' a bit under the pressure in the system. I am thinking of putting in a hybrid pipe system consisting of a short hydraulic hose replacing the quick fit connector (to reduce noise transmission) fitted to the copper pipe to the master - this should, hopefully, give the nice precise pedal feel you get with the copper pipe, without the noise/vibration issue on the diesels. I think getting rid of the quick-release coupling is no bad thing - I think they are more trouble than they are worth - we have seen recent instances of leaks/failures of the coupling (particularly with Tazu items, so it seems).

I'll let you know how it goes if I do get round to this mod.

Cheers

Pete
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Old 11th May 2017, 12:00   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EastPete View Post
Thanks Mike

I have the Tazu master on my car, as you probably know. I thought I saw something posted on here (Delphi technical bulletin ?) saying you can reverse bleed the pre-filled masters - perhaps someone who has attempted it can provide feedback.

My clutch is still good after 1500 miles, but I have noticed the gear change is not as slick since I fitted the HEL hydraulic hose in place of the copper pipe. This hose is quite long (88 cm), so probably 'gives' a bit under the pressure in the system. I am thinking of putting in a hybrid pipe system consisting of a short hydraulic hose replacing the quick fit connector (to reduce noise transmission) fitted to the copper pipe to the master - this should, hopefully, give the nice precise pedal feel you get with the copper pipe, without the noise/vibration issue on the diesels. I think getting rid of the quick-release coupling is no bad thing - I think they are more trouble than they are worth - we have seen recent instances of leaks/failures of the coupling (particularly with Tazu items, so it seems).

I'll let you know how it goes if I do get round to this mod.

Cheers

Pete
Well Pete,remember the quick fit connector was only intended for factory
facilities .

i note on mine ,the gear changes is less slick when cold (box related i guess )

Cheers

Mike
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Old 11th May 2017, 17:19   #15
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Thanks for the input gents, the side on view of the pedal and how it worked when the new master was fitted was very informative. Not going to reverse bleed it at the minute - will see how it goes for a while.

Having driven the car today I should revise the figures I gave yesterday:-
the biting point is around 55 mm from the floor and the top 25 mm of travel does nothing. The pedal feels solid but not as heavy as when first changed 48K ago.
Not sure which brand of clutch, slave and master were fitted but was assured they were best quality by the garage fitting them (I know it is not a metal master). I had not had the car long when the clutch failed and needed it doing ASAP. I had only just heard of the forum at the time... an expensive lesson well learned.
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Old 4th August 2017, 19:04   #16
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Default Had to bleed through and top up again

Well, after just under 4000 miles since I bled the clutch and topped up the master I started to get the odd juddery pulling away when lifting off the clutch.
Spent the first part of the day bleeding through and topping up the master and then wasted around four hours trying to find a way of modding the lid so the master can be filled nearly to the brim...
Have admitted defeat and replaced the black condom ( had to do this twice as did not have it sealing the cap first time ) but know that the master was only holding a little over half of its already limited capacity when I tightened the lid.

I had hoped to use the easibleed lid and a length of tube sticking straight up to allow fluid to expand into before returning to the cylinder when clutch lifted but found it just worked its way out after four or five pedal pushes. Maybe a larger diameter tube?
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Old 4th August 2017, 20:50   #17
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Feel for you, the poor clutch system will kill 75's off as you replace it all thinking thats good but after no time at all it all needs redoing.Probably best to get saving!
__________________
Work done / to do - on "Never Ending Story"!
1. Rattling manifold - replaced.
2. Thermostat - replaced.
3. Both VIS motors - rebuilt & VIS tester made!
4. Non working speedo, fluctuating fuel gauge and ABS fault - sorted!
5. Clutch, slave and master -replaced!
6. Boot leaking badly - Done.
7. Timing belts (all 3 ) due for replacement - to do.
8. Relace faulty 3 speed fan with 2 speed with resistor - replaced.
9. Faulty Reverse light switch - replaced.
10. Headlamp bulbs - replaced
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Old 4th August 2017, 21:14   #18
bigblue75
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What is going on though?
I can't see where the fluid is going as there is no sign of it leaking anywhere before this (or the first) bleed...
Not getting any slip or crunching...
First sign I get is a judder when pulling away which is slight and not often to begin becoming a bit more frequent and slightly more pronounced if not sorted.

Can't see what the problem is with the hydraulic circuit that causes the fluid loss.


Not a problem confined to our cars either, looked at a diesel accord (06) and great car though it is there are known issues with the clutch.
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Old 5th August 2017, 12:40   #19
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Had a search for any details of a mod I think a few members have made; Putting a second reservoir above the master either inside the cabin or under the bonnet to enable you to see the rate of fluid loss and make it easier filling and bleeding the clutch.

If anybody with links, details or especially photos can post what they have that would be great, seems the curse of photobucket strikes again.

Not really wanting to look at replacing parts til after the mot in around two months when a better idea of total cost can be gained. Thanks in advance.
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Old 5th August 2017, 13:37   #20
FrenchMike
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigblue75 View Post
Had a search for any details of a mod I think a few members have made; Putting a second reservoir above the master either inside the cabin or under the bonnet to enable you to see the rate of fluid loss and make it easier filling and bleeding the clutch.

If anybody with links, details or especially photos can post what they have that would be great, seems the curse of photobucket strikes again.

Not really wanting to look at replacing parts til after the mot in around two months when a better idea of total cost can be gained. Thanks in advance.
Hum,add a extra reservoir is usless IMHO .
any leak even tiny can't cure itself .

but a mere air bubble in the circuit brings you lot of troubles

I personally got rid of the quick fit connector for peace of mind

Mike
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