cooling fan replacement

LaurieBW · 8th July 2016, 18:32

2004 R75 CONN CDTi SE TOURER 2L Diesel. Hi guys, It's that 3 speed vs 2 speed fan replacement problem again! Yes, it's happened to me! in preparation of doing the repair, l purchased a 2 speed fan. control box including a silver resistor. This was sold to me as a complete unit, brand new and original Rover part - it came in a white cardboard box with moulded foam packaging inside to hold the contents. On the outside only, the box had printed:- PGJ000110. The rest of the box was plain and no paperwork.
The Control box cover had:- SIEMENS V23143-A1-X3 772-65030-02 M47. Inside on PCB - no date, no numbers or letters (l didn't look on the underside) The fan body was painted black with no ID markings - just a date at the cable entry point: 12 05 2012. Side by side, both old and the new looked the same in manufacture. So, first question, is it a genuine Rover part and/or, is it good for my car? Q2. If yes, do l use the new control box, or do l reuse the old 3 speed box? Sorry to be so long winded, but l don't want to waste time, if what l purchased isn't going to do the job NB. l shall need help with wiring info - if you could point me to the various threads, l would be grateful for that and your time in replying to my enquiry. Thanks guys. LaurieBW. PS l have purchased a gold resistor from Jules, just in case it's a goer.

DMGRS · 8th July 2016, 20:20

PGJ000110 is the correct unit for the diesel car - and being a 2 speed it should fit straight to your vehicle.

To be honest, being an MG Rover genuine part doesn't mean quite as much as it used to - many manufacturers have changed their processes, and some MG Rover parts are made by different companies than those who originally did.

Where was it bought from?

SD1too · 8th July 2016, 20:42

Hi Laurie,

I don't have access to my notes for a few days, but I'll do my best to answer your questions from memory.

Quote:

Originally Posted by LaurieBW

The Control box cover had:- SIEMENS V23143-A1-X3 772-65030-02 M47.

M47 eh? Have a look inside Laurie. Does it have two relays or three?

Quote:

So, first question, is it a genuine Rover part and/or, is it good for my car?

I'm not sure. From memory the 3 speed control boxes were marked 'M47' and the two speed 'PWM2'.

Quote:

If yes, do l use the new control box, or do l reuse the old 3 speed box?

You'd need to modify a 3 speed control box for use with a 2 speed motor circuit.

Quote:

l shall need help with wiring info - if you could point me to the various threads ...

Check the number of relays you have first and report back.

Simon

Arctic · 9th July 2016, 00:56

[QUOTE=SD1too;2326787]Hi Laurie,

I don't have access to my notes for a few days, but I'll do my best to answer your questions from memory.

M47 eh? Have a look inside Laurie. Does it have two relays or three?

Quote:

I'm not sure. From memory the 3 speed control boxes were marked 'M47' and the two speed 'PWM2'.

Simon spot on

M47

1
PMW

2

Unless it is an after market

3

Hopefully these photo's will help you until Simon can give you more detail, if your new fan is genuine Rover one it should be plug and play so to speak

LaurieBW · 10th July 2016, 09:29

Hi there. Thanks for your reply. I purchased the fan unit about 2 years ago from:- South Lakeland MINI Centre Barrow in Furness and paid £180. I was told back then, that Rover fans had a habit of burning out (info from my local MOT garage) so in anticipation of something going wrong!! I got one in - just in case. Laurie.

SD1too · 10th July 2016, 09:51

OK Laurie. The problem is that there are two very odd things about the fan system you have bought:

The control box marked M47 should be for a 3 speed system and you've been told it's 2 speed.
The date, May 2012, is a bit suspicious.

So, we need you to look in the control box as requested to find out how many relays it has. Use Arctic's photographs as a reference. Does it look like the third picture labelled "aftermarket"?

Also, how many wires enter the motor housing: two or four?

Quote:

Originally Posted by LaurieBW

I was told back then, that Rover fans had a habit of burning out (info from my local MOT garage) ..

What happens is that the three speed motors wear out two of their brushes after about 50,000 miles and the two speed motors suffer burned out resistors. In addition, the diesels have a complicated electronic control board which sometimes fails. So as you can see, it's not necessarily a case of just plugging in something you've bought. Some careful diagnosis is needed first.

Hope to hear from you Laurie.

Simon

LaurieBW · 10th July 2016, 10:47

Thanks Arctic and all you others out there, helping me out. Stick with me on this one, as it is a steep learning curve trying to sort out what needs to be done, also, I'm having to learn how to navigate around the 75/ZT club, forums and threads at there same time - so, l might get things wrong. Arctic, thanks for your reply and photos. My old 3 speed fan matches photo No1. it has 3 relays with cables attached to all the tabs. My new 2 speed fan matches photo No3. It has 3 relays with cables attached to only 2 as photo No3. Also, possibly? I may have confused matters by mixing the control covers. There are no ID marks on the other cover plate. What's next? Laurie

LaurieBW · 10th July 2016, 11:02

Hi Simon, thanks for your reply, I have just replied to Arctics post. As l say, l may have mixed the covers up, which might explain the confusion over ID's. Laurie.

LaurieBW · 10th July 2016, 18:04

Simon. It looks as if l have an aftermarket fan - Arctic's photo No3 with 3 relays. 1. can l use my new 2 speed fan, control box and new wiring loom - is this a plug in and go, or do l still need to alter the internal wiring. Or do l still use my old 3 speed control box, alter the wiring and connect my new fan to the old wiring. As wiring changes are required, can you suggest the How-to/threads to follow if this is not in your arsenal of information. My grateful thanks Laurie.

SD1too · 10th July 2016, 19:53

Laurie,

You can simply plug in your new 2 speed system with aftermarket PCB, but the silver resistor will one day fail and you will be back to square one. It's therefore a good idea to fit the gold resistor before installation.

Simon

8th July 2016, 18:32	#1
LaurieBW Newbie 75 Tourer Join Date: Apr 2015 Location: Bournemouth Posts: 10 Thanks: 1 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	cooling fan replacement 2004 R75 CONN CDTi SE TOURER 2L Diesel. Hi guys, It's that 3 speed vs 2 speed fan replacement problem again! Yes, it's happened to me! in preparation of doing the repair, l purchased a 2 speed fan. control box including a silver resistor. This was sold to me as a complete unit, brand new and original Rover part - it came in a white cardboard box with moulded foam packaging inside to hold the contents. On the outside only, the box had printed:- PGJ000110. The rest of the box was plain and no paperwork. The Control box cover had:- SIEMENS V23143-A1-X3 772-65030-02 M47. Inside on PCB - no date, no numbers or letters (l didn't look on the underside) The fan body was painted black with no ID markings - just a date at the cable entry point: 12 05 2012. Side by side, both old and the new looked the same in manufacture. So, first question, is it a genuine Rover part and/or, is it good for my car? Q2. If yes, do l use the new control box, or do l reuse the old 3 speed box? Sorry to be so long winded, but l don't want to waste time, if what l purchased isn't going to do the job NB. l shall need help with wiring info - if you could point me to the various threads, l would be grateful for that and your time in replying to my enquiry. Thanks guys. LaurieBW. PS l have purchased a gold resistor from Jules, just in case it's a goer.

8th July 2016, 20:20	#2
DMGRS Discount MG Rover Spares Rover 75 CDTi, 2x MG ZS180 Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: Hythe, Southampton Posts: 11,320 Thanks: 456 Thanked 3,377 Times in 2,027 Posts	PGJ000110 is the correct unit for the diesel car - and being a 2 speed it should fit straight to your vehicle. To be honest, being an MG Rover genuine part doesn't mean quite as much as it used to - many manufacturers have changed their processes, and some MG Rover parts are made by different companies than those who originally did. Where was it bought from? __________________ Your trusted MG Rover specialist! Tel: 02380 001133 / Email: [email protected] We now have a 'chat' function on our site for even quicker replies. Give it a try! Remember - discount code FORUM5 for 5% off

10th July 2016, 19:53	#10
SD1too Doesn't do things by halves Rover 75 2.5 Connoisseur Auto (1999) Dealer launch model. Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Former Middlesex Posts: 20,382 Thanks: 1,587 Thanked 3,749 Times in 3,181 Posts	Laurie, You can simply plug in your new 2 speed system with aftermarket PCB, but the silver resistor will one day fail and you will be back to square one. It's therefore a good idea to fit the gold resistor before installation. Simon __________________ "Whatever is rightly done, however humble, is noble." Sir Henry Royce.

10th July 2016, 09:29	#5
LaurieBW Newbie 75 Tourer Join Date: Apr 2015 Location: Bournemouth Posts: 10 Thanks: 1 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Hi there. Thanks for your reply. I purchased the fan unit about 2 years ago from:- South Lakeland MINI Centre Barrow in Furness and paid £180. I was told back then, that Rover fans had a habit of burning out (info from my local MOT garage) so in anticipation of something going wrong!! I got one in - just in case. Laurie.

10th July 2016, 10:47	#7
LaurieBW Newbie 75 Tourer Join Date: Apr 2015 Location: Bournemouth Posts: 10 Thanks: 1 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Thanks Arctic and all you others out there, helping me out. Stick with me on this one, as it is a steep learning curve trying to sort out what needs to be done, also, I'm having to learn how to navigate around the 75/ZT club, forums and threads at there same time - so, l might get things wrong. Arctic, thanks for your reply and photos. My old 3 speed fan matches photo No1. it has 3 relays with cables attached to all the tabs. My new 2 speed fan matches photo No3. It has 3 relays with cables attached to only 2 as photo No3. Also, possibly? I may have confused matters by mixing the control covers. There are no ID marks on the other cover plate. What's next? Laurie

10th July 2016, 11:02	#8
LaurieBW Newbie 75 Tourer Join Date: Apr 2015 Location: Bournemouth Posts: 10 Thanks: 1 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Hi Simon, thanks for your reply, I have just replied to Arctics post. As l say, l may have mixed the covers up, which might explain the confusion over ID's. Laurie.

10th July 2016, 18:04	#9
LaurieBW Newbie 75 Tourer Join Date: Apr 2015 Location: Bournemouth Posts: 10 Thanks: 1 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Simon. It looks as if l have an aftermarket fan - Arctic's photo No3 with 3 relays. 1. can l use my new 2 speed fan, control box and new wiring loom - is this a plug in and go, or do l still need to alter the internal wiring. Or do l still use my old 3 speed control box, alter the wiring and connect my new fan to the old wiring. As wiring changes are required, can you suggest the How-to/threads to follow if this is not in your arsenal of information. My grateful thanks Laurie.