Disaster - cambelt failure, KV6 heads wanted

[StewartIngram]

Went up to Conisbrough yesterday, on the way back on the A1 the cambelt failed at Tuxford. Got home with the AA ok (great service) and started investigating today. I shall know full details possibly tomorrow, but expecting valve damage? I therefore will probably be looking for a pair of heads - can anyone assist please?

Stewart

[SD1too]

Originally Posted by StewartIngram

.. on the A1 the cambelt failed ... Got home with the AA ok (great service) and started investigating today.

What have you found so far Stewart? Was it your diagnosis or the AA's? I'd be very interested to know the service history and in particular the mileage covered by the tensioner and idler pulleys.

I offer my commiserations.

Simon

[StewartIngram]

I've got the back covers off and those belts are ok. I had diagnosed before the AA came that it was a likely cambelt fault. The engine suddenly lost power on the A1, rev counter still showed rpm when in gear. Took it out of gear and coasted round the corner at the junction; rev counter stopped . Turned the key and the engine spun over. Seemed to be low compression, confirmed by the AA. Plugged my test box in, it gave a fault of the cam sensor.
Tomorrow I'll jack up the engine and remove the o/s engine mount etc so that I can remove the cover off the the front belt. I've already loosened the cover, and the belt feels very loose. As it was turning over, I suspect it may not be broken? Possibly the tensioner seized - we will see.
I've had the car about 3 years, 123k miles. When I bought it, (around 90k?), I had proof of cambelt change at around 70k. My initial thoughts were that a rear belt had gone, possibly because they had been untouched (it appears these can be overlooked). Not to be however.
In the boot was a brand new water pump, suggesting that hadn't been changed with the belt, and probably the tensioner wasn't either.
I converted it to lpg, and extended the hose from the heater, at its join under the throttle body, round to the lpg vapouriser (near the osf suspension mount) and back to that joint. I've had a minor leak for a while which I thought was a manifold gasket in the V; now I've got better access I've also found a leak at the join to the heater hose! So this gives me opportunity to not only sort the belt (or whatever) but catch up on a few other things. The list appears to be:
Change all 3 belts anyway.
Water pump.
Belt tensioner.
That heater hose joint.
Thorough check of all hoses etc while I can see them.
Manifold gaskets.
Heads/valves - probably damaged.
Camshaft cover breather (?) hole check/clean.
Anything minor that I get access to as well.
Quite a list, might as well do it all at once. Going to be a busy time, but I'll get it done. Thinking that s/h heads might be cheaper/easier than replacing valves?

Stewart

[SD1too]

Thanks for an excellent report Stewart. I'm pleased to see that you're thinking positively.

Originally Posted by StewartIngram

Thinking that s/h heads might be cheaper/easier than replacing valves?

Maybe, but I'd stick with the heads you know.

When you expose the front of the engine, a photo would be interesting!

Simon

[StewartIngram]

I've done some more dis-assembly today, got delayed by a couple of awkward bolts and ran out of time before I could get the bottom pulley undone. However I did get a few pics.
Pic 1 and 2 are incidental to the belts. Pic 1 shows the water leak I was aware of, seems to be the manifold gasket on cyl 2. However, with things now removed I have sight of the connector on the heater hose, which looks worse. Ignore the fresh puddles from removing the hose!
Pic 3 shows the mess inside the belt cover on bank 2, and pic 5 shows the inside of bank 1 cover.
Pic 4 shows the first sighting of the belt, on bank 2 pulley. At this stage I still had a lot of dismantling to see more.
On removing the bank 1 cover it became apparent the belt was broken. I've lifted the end of the belt to show this in Pic 6
Pic 7 shows a split in the belt at bank 2.
Pic 8 is viewd down towards the idler pulley, with more damage to the belt, and more 'swarf'.
All in, quite a mess.
Tomorrow morning I should have full access to the full belt area.

Stewart

[trikey]

Originally Posted by SD1too

Maybe, but I'd stick with the heads you know.

Not always a good idea, you have the risk of damage to valve guides and seats that can be difficult to spot.

I rebuilt a members 190 engine earlier this year following a similar breakdown, I put two good known heads on as its a lot easier as well!

[StewartIngram]

Remaining pics from post above

[SD1too]

Originally Posted by StewartIngram

I've had the car about 3 years, 123k miles.
When I bought it ... I had proof of cambelt change at around 70k.

As xsport says, it would be wise to renew both the tensioner pulley and the idler pulley at the current mileage of 123k. My originals were running roughly at 90k, yours have covered at least 123k - 70k = 53k, possibly more if you don't have an invoice for them at 70k.

Simon

[StewartIngram]

Time for more pics, at long last I've sorted them out. I'll have to send them over a few posts due to site limits.
Pic 9 - the lower cover after removal. Some of the debris has dropped off.
Pic 10 - the front plate removed, again some debris lost but still plenty there.
Pic 11 - close up bank 1 side, showing where the belt has been scuffing it.
Pic 12 - close up bank 2 side. Debris looks like damp wood, with mud? But I think it must be shreds of inside the belt?
Pic 13 - More debris.

It seems that Pic 9 won't load. Maybe later?

[StewartIngram]

Next batch, looking at the front of the engine.

Pic 14-Pic 19 - all looking at the run of the main belt. Unbelievable how much debris & dirt in there. Note where the belt has run off-centre on the pullies. (Also some debris has fallen on to the lower toothed pulled during dismantling).