Purge Brake Lines of fluid, procedure?

[Frogmella]

Originally Posted by Alan_M

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich in Vancouver View Post
Pipe flaring is an acquired skill.
On the rare occasions I have done it I tend to get one perfect flare followed by a total dud.
Good Luck!

There isn't a pipe kit available for the 75/ZT is there?
A lot depends on the quality of the tool you are using. I have never had a bad flare, even on steel pipes from my first flare and I’m no professional. Mines the old version of this - https://www.sykes-pickavant.com/prod...ring-tools/584

Just used it this week to make this repair section - bends made using the tool with the kit. You will often find only the sections near the wheel arches need replacing, and there’s no problem cutting back to where pipe is good and just replacing rusty section.
Also I would strongly recommend using kunifer (copper-nickel alloy) pipe rather than the plain copper. This does not work harden like the copper and does not fail by fracturing like copper will.

I can't afford this Sykes tool. Thats why I have a 17 year old car and repair it myself.



I have a Draper Kit and will just have to practice a bit, for some reason most of the flares I make are coming out less than symmetrical. My missus describes them as "on the wonk". I have watched a few YouTube videos using the same or similar kit but they all differ slightly in technique and I'm not exactly sure what a proper double flare should finally look like. If anyone has a photo of one I would be grateful if you would post it here. Thanks.

[roverbarmy]

Use some oil on the pipe ends to avoid grip-skewing as you tighten the tool and don't over-tighten the work, taking the shaping too far. Practise on a few offcuts of pipe first.

[HarryM1BYT]

Originally Posted by roverbarmy

Use some oil on the pipe ends to avoid grip-skewing as you tighten the tool and don't over-tighten the work, taking the shaping too far. Practise on a few offcuts of pipe first.

The flaring kit I bought some 30/40 years ago, came with some sort of grease to use on the pipe ends.

[marinabrian]

Originally Posted by Frogmella

I can't afford this Sykes tool. Thats why I have a 17 year old car and repair it myself.



I have a Draper Kit and will just have to practice a bit, for some reason most of the flares I make are coming out less than symmetrical. My missus describes them as "on the wonk". I have watched a few YouTube videos using the same or similar kit but they all differ slightly in technique and I'm not exactly sure what a proper double flare should finally look like. If anyone has a photo of one I would be grateful if you would post it here. Thanks.

Is the pipe flaring kit you are using look like this?



If it is, then you can forget ever being able to joint original steel pipework with it.

I have a set like the one pictured, and it is suitable for copper pipe but that's about it.

Tell you what, I'll dig it out and see if I can produce a double flare for you

While I'm doing that, take a look HERE and ask yourself something along these lines........I'm going to invest in my safety and that of the others who I share the roads with, I know funds are tight at the minute, but this is something that will be used time and time again, and even if I use it once to do the job, I can sell it on to the next person.


I'll see what I can do

Brian

[Frogmella]

So far I've tried with and without lubricant (light oil and brake fluid). Filing square. Chamfering and not chamfering both the inside and sometimes also the outside edge. Tightening the second stage hard down and not so hard.


Hardly any (about one in ten) comes out neat, symmetrical and sitting nicely atop the fitting. It usually looks OK after the first flare but things seem to go wrong during the second.


But, on the bright side, I've got plenty of pipe to experiment with and nowhere to go at the moment.



By the time I'm done I'll be the world's foremost expert on pipe flaring using cheap DIY equipment (or I might be forced to give up and have to pay the local garage before the next MOT in September).

[marinabrian]

Originally Posted by Frogmella

So far I've tried with and without lubricant (light oil and brake fluid). Filing square. Chamfering and not chamfering both the inside and sometimes also the outside edge. Tightening the second stage hard down and not so hard.


Hardly any (about one in ten) comes out neat, symmetrical and sitting nicely atop the fitting. It usually looks OK after the first flare but things seem to go wrong during the second.


But, on the bright side, I've got plenty of pipe to experiment with and nowhere to go at the moment.



By the time I'm done I'll be the world's foremost expert on pipe flaring using cheap DIY equipment (or I might be forced to give up and have to pay the local garage before the next MOT in September).

Right, here we go Alex........

First, a steel pipe, double flare formed with my flaremaster.......



Next a side view of the kunifer double flare formed with the cheap tool.....



And fitted to a male union........



Viewed from end on, note the distortion of the tube........



Now compare to the steel pipe formed with the flaremaster..........



The steel pipe was an offcut from a flare formed on the car with the Sykes-Pickavant flaremaster, where I forgot to thread to fit the union onto the pipe before forming the flare !

Note the the marks to the outer section of Kunifer pipe, caused by the serrated jaws of the die clamp, compared to no marks on the steel one, and despite the considerable difference in the hardness of the material, the superior shape of the flare formed on the steel pipe.

They say a bad workman blames his tools, however there are times when a superior quality tool not only pays for itself time and time again, by producing consistent high quality results, but overall gives a sense of satisfaction when the job works first time.

You will never be able to form a satisfactory flare on steel pipework using the cheap tool, so it will always be a point to point replacement of entire pipe runs, and if you are considering giving up and having a garage do the job, you need to budget for more that you would pay for the basic flaremaster kit in the link

I've owned both tools for over twenty years, and they have paid for themselves many times over, the cheap tool is excellent to work with 5/16 pipework for fixed fuel lines etc, but I'd never use it for brake pipes ever again, over the Flaremaster

Practice makes perfect, but this is one of those cases where the right tool make the job both practical and possible.

Have fun

Brian

[RoverP480]

I have a cam operated bench type tool which I have been using for the last 40 odd years . Cost something like £30 when I bought it which was my weeks wages. Worth every penny, and as long as the pipe is cut square its impossible to make a poor flare . If I was buying one now I would go for something like the flaremaster as mine cannot be used on the vehicle.

[Frogmella]

Originally Posted by marinabrian

Is the pipe flaring kit you are using look like this?



If it is, then you can forget ever being able to joint original steel pipework with it.

I have a set like the one pictured, and it is suitable for copper pipe but that's about it.

Tell you what, I'll dig it out and see if I can produce a double flare for you

While I'm doing that, take a look HERE and ask yourself something along these lines........I'm going to invest in my safety and that of the others who I share the roads with, I know funds are tight at the minute, but this is something that will be used time and time again, and even if I use it once to do the job, I can sell it on to the next person.


I'll see what I can do

Brian

OK, since that is HALF the price I had seen elsewhere I have purchased the Sykes tool. As you rightly say, I can always sell it on ( along with the Draper one.)

[Alan_M]

Originally Posted by Frogmella

OK, since that is HALF the price I had seen elsewhere I have purchased the Sykes tool. As you rightly say, I can always sell it on ( along with the Draper one.)

You won’t regret it. It makes the job so much easier.

[Frogmella]

Originally Posted by Alan_M

You won’t regret it. It makes the job so much easier.

I also thought that there is little point asking for advice from the forum if I'm not going to follow it.


Thanks everyone for taking an interest, I really appreciate it.