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Old 9th December 2021, 12:52   #41
wraymond
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In almost all major companies the ‘escalation’ of issues is ‘filed’ within the first, or second, line of management. That’s what modern Management is really all about. Almost every lower line manager is envious of his immediate senior (I nearly put ‘superior’ but that would have assumed ‘better’ and the argument would have fallen). Witness: the number of promotion prospects who decline the promotion – vanishingly small (that explains the advancement of the inadequate applicant/proteges like a certain Hancock et al.

Ergo, only relationships rule and that is the first rule. Ask any entrepreneur about their opinion of hierarchies. That’s a proven entrepreneur, not just a lucky one.
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Old 9th December 2021, 13:16   #42
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Again, this is overly optimistic. All BJ has to do is mention control taken back, leveling up, perhaps throw in a little tax cut to help house prices upwards and he'll regain his popularity in an instant.
If he looses some of his Andy cap support in the NE and some from his own party who are on the right wing, he’s in trouble. The LibDems are trying to appeal to moderate tory voters. Isn’t there a coming up by-election shortly? If that one is lost, he might have to walk the plank.
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Old 9th December 2021, 13:50   #43
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Just heard his wife has just had their second baby, a great time to make a christmas party from last year seem to vanish....

I seen Matt Hancock getting interviewed in a video clip from GMB, just wish he said he knew, it might have added some more heat to the PM
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Old 9th December 2021, 15:36   #44
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Reading between the lines of your post this is my understanding of what you are saying, if one was to escalate they would be in trouble. You have therefore hit a nail on the head as to why we may very well hear again, that opportunities were missed but lessons have been learnt.

I was never sacked but I was spoken to on more then one occasion while working for BT, my approach was to deal myself, if no luck pass to manager, if no result, escalate and so on to GM and even CEO. The last thing I ever did when I left Openreach/BT was to send an email all the way up my management chain highlighting the company attitude but it did include a thank you and a wish the company all the best.

It is every employees responsibility to take their "company" forward is some way.


macafee2

I would not have put it quite like that myself, but your overall direction of thinking is correct.

If we look at what has been happening in the UK (and many other industrialised countries) since the 1980's, the earnings gap between the top layers of management and the working masses have widened year on year. The system that has evolved pays the top layer extremely high salaries and bonuses in order to deliver efficiencies. This in reality is another name for axing jobs as there is no often efficiency improvement involved. You simply cannot improve the efficiency of an industrial operation by 8%-10% year on year. What you can do is reduce costs by these amounts year on year by axing jobs. This is why overall the business or leadership capability of so many of our 'managers' is so poor. Often they do not have any such capability.

When jobs are axed, it invariably means that those who still retain jobs have greater pressures on them to do more for less. So if someone was to escalate on the basis of workloads they are in fact escalating on the basis of poor but highly rewarding policies or actions of those to whom you are escalating, especially if the escalation is to your second or higher line level.

The above scenario is now almost universal in front line services - in councils, hospitals, education and so on.

In private industry the same pressures exist because the financial markets demand increasing profits and therefore lower cost bases in order to sustain our services based economy i.e. the salaries of financial traders and bankers.

In Openreach, you were lucky in that you have a CEO in Clive Selley who has risen through the BT business from being an engineer. He understands every detail of the telecomms business. But, even he is not in a position to resist the commercial pressures from the markets.

So, I agree, that what we are now calling failures, after the event, will be repeated because the fundamentals of the equation will not have changed.

To finish off on a positive note, we are very good at holding equiries after the event!

Last edited by MSS; 9th December 2021 at 15:40..
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Old 9th December 2021, 18:28   #45
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Originally Posted by MSS View Post
I would not have put it quite like that myself, but your overall direction of thinking is correct.

If we look at what has been happening in the UK (and many other industrialised countries) since the 1980's, the earnings gap between the top layers of management and the working masses have widened year on year. The system that has evolved pays the top layer extremely high salaries and bonuses in order to deliver efficiencies. This in reality is another name for axing jobs as there is no often efficiency improvement involved. You simply cannot improve the efficiency of an industrial operation by 8%-10% year on year. What you can do is reduce costs by these amounts year on year by axing jobs. This is why overall the business or leadership capability of so many of our 'managers' is so poor. Often they do not have any such capability.

When jobs are axed, it invariably means that those who still retain jobs have greater pressures on them to do more for less. So if someone was to escalate on the basis of workloads they are in fact escalating on the basis of poor but highly rewarding policies or actions of those to whom you are escalating, especially if the escalation is to your second or higher line level.

The above scenario is now almost universal in front line services - in councils, hospitals, education and so on.

In private industry the same pressures exist because the financial markets demand increasing profits and therefore lower cost bases in order to sustain our services based economy i.e. the salaries of financial traders and bankers.

In Openreach, you were lucky in that you have a CEO in Clive Selley who has risen through the BT business from being an engineer. He understands every detail of the telecomms business. But, even he is not in a position to resist the commercial pressures from the markets.

So, I agree, that what we are now calling failures, after the event, will be repeated because the fundamentals of the equation will not have changed.

To finish off on a positive note, we are very good at holding equiries after the event!
and that is why we have whistle blowers

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Old 9th December 2021, 21:38   #46
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The pressure is building up on BoJo, Mr Gove will be getting all excited that he may have to rescue the government. Could it be the beginning of the end?
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Old 10th December 2021, 07:36   #47
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The pressure is building up on BoJo, Mr Gove will be getting all excited that he may have to rescue the government. Could it be the beginning of the end?
He will be, but bet Bojo manages to wriggle out......
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Old 10th December 2021, 08:13   #48
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The pressure is building up on BoJo, Mr Gove will be getting all excited that he may have to rescue the government. Could it be the beginning of the end?
Fingers crossed for the beginning of the end for them.
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He will be, but bet Bojo manages to wriggle out......
Sadly I think you a right, a large number of people seem quite happy to have been lied too and made fools of.
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Old 10th December 2021, 08:15   #49
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He may well do. The Tories will be ruthless when they decide it’s time to go.
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Old 10th December 2021, 13:01   #50
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Originally Posted by macafee2 View Post
my post is not about your niece but about child protection but I will use your post.
1. If the work load is too much, escalate to management
2. If social services cannot gain entry to check on the child escalate to management, police, someone to take it further. and keep checking progress
3. If first line management do nothing, escalate to second line and so forth
4. Make sure there is a documented trail

I think the problem becomes when a child or adult is in danger and not seen by social services and nothing/not enough is done about it.

I am sure none of us want to hear again from an enquiry that opportunities were missed or hear again from social services that lessons will be learnt.

I don't work in social services but perhaps what action staff can take needs to be rebrieffed and if there is not a decent course of action... gaining legal entry by force then we need to give them that power. Someones life could be at risk, lets not pussyfoot around, let me see the child/adult or I will huff and puff and blow your house down to gain entry


macafee2
What makes you think that this escalation isn't happening already? I would be amazed if the social workers in this tragic case hadn't done their best to help, yet they suffer the same problem as almost every part of the public sector: too much task and too little resource. And the lockdown added a new layer of complexity, more so than in most lines of work. Keep checking progress? How is that possible when the number of cases only keeps growing? Which means more cases which get escalated - to the same overworked manager.

And it's unrealistic to claim that involving the Police is the answer - guess what, they are under the same pressures. Their numbers were cut massively (by the Tories, in case anyone has forgotten), yet the breadth of their responsibilities has increased markedly. As well as all the traditional law enforcement activities, they also have to cope with cyber crime, hate crime, and now pandemic-related offences as well.

I'm not suggesting that failures by Police or social services should be overlooked - they make some terrible mistakes, including the truly awful case of Arthur - but in many cases they have been set up to fail. And remember that for every Arthur or Baby P, there are numerous other cases which don't make the news because they have a happier (or at least less sad) ending. Very few people get out of bed in the morning wanting to be rubbish at their job!
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