High Line System Dead - Help! - Page 2

Dr Funk · 12th January 2013, 14:55

I took out the screw at the top centre of the IPK after removing the cowl, seems to stick at the bottom right, the bottom left begins to slide forward. Unfortunately I have an airbag in the A pillar! I might have to leave that for now.

I am still trying to get at the header, removed the heater controls but not yet able to shift the ashtray and cup holder part, I'm hoping not to have to remove the centre console.

The header is the point at which the car loom and the highline loom meet if I've understood you correctly and it's 12V on the k-bus I should be seeing. Is the k-bus marked the same colours in the rest of the car wiring as in the highline wiring?

suffolk boy · 12th January 2013, 15:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr Funk

I took out the screw at the top centre of the IPK after removing the cowl, seems to stick at the bottom right, the bottom left begins to slide forward. Unfortunately I have an airbag in the A pillar! I might have to leave that for now.

I am still trying to get at the header, removed the heater controls but not yet able to shift the ashtray and cup holder part, I'm hoping not to have to remove the centre console.

The header is the point at which the car loom and the highline loom meet if I've understood you correctly and it's 12V on the k-bus I should be seeing. Is the k-bus marked the same colours in the rest of the car wiring as in the highline wiring?

yes the kbus wire is the same thro out the system red white with a yellow stripe.as for the ipk they can be tight it helps to give it a push from the back.the lower console containing the ashtray has 2 clips tucked away down each side.they at the front of the unit you can feel them push on these and it will come out.you will find the connector tucked down on the left hand side .no need to remove the centre console.btw i asume on the radio module you have checked its external fuse where it plugs in underneath?

Dr Funk · 12th January 2013, 18:36

I took out the screw but it seemed to be sticking underneath particularly to the right. My A pillar has the airbag unfortunately so I'll leave that for now.

I've got to some of the wiring behind the ashtray, there is a small connector with about 6 wires which has the k-bus, it is reading low here too. I found a document regarding the BMW busses and looks like there are more than one arrangement. The one that I think corresponds with the High Line (High Instrument Cluster in BMW speak) has a k-bus and a seperate bus, i-bus for the ICE. If this is equivalent to the high line then this could mean a failure of the i-bus signal at the instrument cluster and would explain why the k-bus is up and running but the ICE (i-bus) is not. Just a thought.
It also explains the many variants of the IPK that were available with specific ones for the highline. Anyway, this is all speculation but would be interested in your opinion.

Dr Funk · 15th January 2013, 16:18

Ok, thanks, I've had to put it all back together for now as I'm travelling for work this week. However the situation so far is:
K-bus low voltage high impedance <1V >1M ohm so no short and with all units disconnected on the highline system. This suggest a connection to something as there is a small voltage present. As everything else in the car is working, the k-bus must be working normally assuming it is a single bus connecting the highline and the other vehicle functions. In this case there is a disconnect somewhere between the highline part of the bus and the rest of the car. I need to find the point at which the highline loom connects to the car, so far could not definitely identify this in the centre console, the closest being a small flat connector containing around 6 wires including k-bus. The k-bus here was already measuring low.

I was not able to get the IPK out it seems to be well and truly stuck on the right hand side, anymore force than I am applying and I'm sure something will break. I need to remove trim panels on the driver side to see if I can reach the back of the IPK to push.

So far there is no sign of any water damage anywhere or any clue as to what the problem might be other than the k-bus being wrong.

Geoff130 · 15th January 2013, 18:40

Hi, I have attached a picture of the header, this one I have removed the base and most of the connectors from while making my loom but you can see the red/white and yellow k-bus wire, hope this helps.

Duotone · 15th January 2013, 19:14

This is the plug that connects the Hi Line system located down by the ashtray, in older 75's it's a BMW plug, later models have ISO connectors.

This is the plug [C0982] that normally has the K Bus wire for the Hi Line system. I say normally sometimes if it's not in the plug, it taped up in the loom for the same plug.

Also it shows the BMW plug [C0981] and socket pulled up to the rear of the headunit.

Dave T

Dr Funk · 20th January 2013, 18:44

Geoff, Dave, thanks for the pictures, I remember seeing C0982/C03089 connectors with the k-bus on it, it was reading 0V at this point. The connector C0981 was the one I could not locate though there was one like it connected to the body control unit under the glove compartment.
I will have another dig when I get the chance hopefully later this coming week and let you know what I find.
Thanks again.

TRaction · 18th February 2013, 01:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr Funk

Geoff, Dave, thanks for the pictures, I remember seeing C0982/C03089 connectors with the k-bus on it, it was reading 0V at this point. The connector C0981 was the one I could not locate though there was one like it connected to the body control unit under the glove compartment.
I will have another dig when I get the chance hopefully later this coming week and let you know what I find.
Thanks again.

G'day. I read this thread with interest, and wonder if you found what was happening. I understood from the other posts, that your hypothesis was the k-bus ought float with everything removed, but that you hadn't been able to remove the instrument cluster, and had not been able to find the cause of your low voltage readings on the k-bus right? (not implying you should try this, as I imagine cost prohibits, hence DIY diagnostic here) so without implying, I am wondering if the T4 would ba capable of diagnosing this fault? I only recently bought my 2001 Con 75 (purchased with broken timing belt) and have had water ingress to drivers side well, so am reading as much as possible before I begin plotting the restoration. Anyway, would love to know if you resolved this issue, even if my T4 question is silly.. Cheers Adam

Dr Funk · 14th March 2013, 15:27

Hi, Never did solve the problem, I have been too busy to carry on but looks like there is a break in the k-bus signal somewhere. I have located C0982 and C0389, (see post above) there is a 12V on at least one end of this, but cannot get a definitive on the other end, it does not appear to connect to anything (unless I'm not connecting to it properly for my measurement - I don't want to damage the wire if I can help it) so may be a break somewhere else. I need to carry on looking. I had also noticed another k-bus marked wire in the loom where the one seperates to the connector.

My guess would be that a T4 would identify the missing components that the k-bus should be connected to- but I guess I already know they are not connected, so just need to locate the break, I have a horrible feeling it will be in some inaccessible part of the loom. I have toyed with the idea of bridging from a known working part to a non working part, but I don't like the idea of hacking into the loom.

Dr Funk · 17th March 2013, 18:33

Latest observation, kbus connection at one end of the C0982/C03089 connection (with the connector seperated) has a healthy 12V on it. This must be the car loom side. The other part of the connector should connect to the HighLine loom but has a 360K ohm impedance to the kbus at any other point of the High Line loom. There must be another connector somewhere which splits the kbus off into a number of kbus lines to connect to the various units. Anyone any idea where such a connector might be located in the Highline Loom? I'm guessing my problem is on or on the way to that connection.

12th January 2013, 14:55	#11
Dr Funk Newbie MG ZT-T 190SE, Truimph Sprint ST 1050 Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Brighton Posts: 15 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	I took out the screw at the top centre of the IPK after removing the cowl, seems to stick at the bottom right, the bottom left begins to slide forward. Unfortunately I have an airbag in the A pillar! I might have to leave that for now. I am still trying to get at the header, removed the heater controls but not yet able to shift the ashtray and cup holder part, I'm hoping not to have to remove the centre console. The header is the point at which the car loom and the highline loom meet if I've understood you correctly and it's 12V on the k-bus I should be seeing. Is the k-bus marked the same colours in the rest of the car wiring as in the highline wiring?

12th January 2013, 18:36	#13
Dr Funk Newbie MG ZT-T 190SE, Truimph Sprint ST 1050 Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Brighton Posts: 15 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	I took out the screw but it seemed to be sticking underneath particularly to the right. My A pillar has the airbag unfortunately so I'll leave that for now. I've got to some of the wiring behind the ashtray, there is a small connector with about 6 wires which has the k-bus, it is reading low here too. I found a document regarding the BMW busses and looks like there are more than one arrangement. The one that I think corresponds with the High Line (High Instrument Cluster in BMW speak) has a k-bus and a seperate bus, i-bus for the ICE. If this is equivalent to the high line then this could mean a failure of the i-bus signal at the instrument cluster and would explain why the k-bus is up and running but the ICE (i-bus) is not. Just a thought. It also explains the many variants of the IPK that were available with specific ones for the highline. Anyway, this is all speculation but would be interested in your opinion.

15th January 2013, 16:18	#14
Dr Funk Newbie MG ZT-T 190SE, Truimph Sprint ST 1050 Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Brighton Posts: 15 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Ok, thanks, I've had to put it all back together for now as I'm travelling for work this week. However the situation so far is: K-bus low voltage high impedance <1V >1M ohm so no short and with all units disconnected on the highline system. This suggest a connection to something as there is a small voltage present. As everything else in the car is working, the k-bus must be working normally assuming it is a single bus connecting the highline and the other vehicle functions. In this case there is a disconnect somewhere between the highline part of the bus and the rest of the car. I need to find the point at which the highline loom connects to the car, so far could not definitely identify this in the centre console, the closest being a small flat connector containing around 6 wires including k-bus. The k-bus here was already measuring low. I was not able to get the IPK out it seems to be well and truly stuck on the right hand side, anymore force than I am applying and I'm sure something will break. I need to remove trim panels on the driver side to see if I can reach the back of the IPK to push. So far there is no sign of any water damage anywhere or any clue as to what the problem might be other than the k-bus being wrong.

15th January 2013, 19:14	#16
Duotone This is my second home 75 Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Leeds Posts: 8,432 Thanks: 176 Thanked 907 Times in 716 Posts	This is the plug that connects the Hi Line system located down by the ashtray, in older 75's it's a BMW plug, later models have ISO connectors. This is the plug [C0982] that normally has the K Bus wire for the Hi Line system. I say normally sometimes if it's not in the plug, it taped up in the loom for the same plug. Also it shows the BMW plug [C0981] and socket pulled up to the rear of the headunit. Dave T

20th January 2013, 18:44	#17
Dr Funk Newbie MG ZT-T 190SE, Truimph Sprint ST 1050 Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Brighton Posts: 15 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Geoff, Dave, thanks for the pictures, I remember seeing C0982/C03089 connectors with the k-bus on it, it was reading 0V at this point. The connector C0981 was the one I could not locate though there was one like it connected to the body control unit under the glove compartment. I will have another dig when I get the chance hopefully later this coming week and let you know what I find. Thanks again.

14th March 2013, 15:27	#19
Dr Funk Newbie MG ZT-T 190SE, Truimph Sprint ST 1050 Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Brighton Posts: 15 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Hi, Never did solve the problem, I have been too busy to carry on but looks like there is a break in the k-bus signal somewhere. I have located C0982 and C0389, (see post above) there is a 12V on at least one end of this, but cannot get a definitive on the other end, it does not appear to connect to anything (unless I'm not connecting to it properly for my measurement - I don't want to damage the wire if I can help it) so may be a break somewhere else. I need to carry on looking. I had also noticed another k-bus marked wire in the loom where the one seperates to the connector. My guess would be that a T4 would identify the missing components that the k-bus should be connected to- but I guess I already know they are not connected, so just need to locate the break, I have a horrible feeling it will be in some inaccessible part of the loom. I have toyed with the idea of bridging from a known working part to a non working part, but I don't like the idea of hacking into the loom.

17th March 2013, 18:33	#20
Dr Funk Newbie MG ZT-T 190SE, Truimph Sprint ST 1050 Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Brighton Posts: 15 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Latest observation, kbus connection at one end of the C0982/C03089 connection (with the connector seperated) has a healthy 12V on it. This must be the car loom side. The other part of the connector should connect to the HighLine loom but has a 360K ohm impedance to the kbus at any other point of the High Line loom. There must be another connector somewhere which splits the kbus off into a number of kbus lines to connect to the various units. Anyone any idea where such a connector might be located in the Highline Loom? I'm guessing my problem is on or on the way to that connection.