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Old 5th December 2021, 14:51   #11
FantasticMrFish
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Originally Posted by T-Cut View Post
Hello Shaun, so the pump's running, but there's insufficient juice getting to the engine to start it. This suggests two possibilities. Either the pump's pumping mechanism has failed (most unlikely I reckon) or there's a filter issue. I'd bet on the latter.
You're car's in the right age bracket to be susceptible to FFS (Fuel Filter Syndrome) so it's pretty likely to be the cause. If the filter leakage is bad enough, the fuel pressure drops too low to start the engine. Whatever fuel is in the tank will also get transfered away from the pump side to ultimately leave it high and dry. Continuous attempts to start the engine will ensure that, so adding a few litres to the tank (which goes into the pump side) may allow the engine to start. However, the fix for FFS is to fit the orange clip. Remember also, that opening up the filter module out of curiosity may make matters worse by displacing the O-ring sealing the filter case. I've been there and done that and it doubles the work. So, check if the filter has an orange clip fitted and if not, fit one. That will eliminate the primary cause of non-starting in later petrol models.
Good luck.
TC
EDIT: I was writing this as you were updating your thread.
The item you're holding is the fuel vapour canister purge valve which clips to the wall of the battery box. It's an emissions control system and not associated with non-starting. The filter element will look manky. They go black within a few months from new. It isn't a service item and should be fine. Fit a clip as suggested and take it from there.
The 1.8T pump fuse is rated 30amps.
Cheers for the advice T-cut. You made me paranoid so I went back out to check the filter again and I had dislodged the bigger oring inside the filter housing. I'm guessing I did that during the first disassembly as it hasn't rectified the situation but at least it's back in place now.

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Old 5th December 2021, 15:45   #12
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Is it just the diesels that work over 1/4 tank or does that apply to petrols too.
I would say that normally you don't have to worry about fuel tank level with the petrol engines.
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Ok, so having enlisted the help of the better half I had my ear to the pump when she turned on the ignition and the pump appears to be "pumping".
Great! Thanks to your better half for literally lending a hand. I thought the pump would be ok; they rarely if ever give trouble.

I was going to suggest that, following the "ignition on" pump priming test, you could follow up with the cranking test. If the pump fails to operate during cranking then the crankshaft position sensor circuit is where you should look.

But start with following T-Cut's advice on ensuring that the filter canister is tight and suitably clipped.

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Old 5th December 2021, 17:20   #13
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- - - I had dislodged the bigger oring inside the filter housing. I'm guessing I did that during the first disassembly as it hasn't rectified the situation but at least it's back in place now.
If that's the case, renew the o-ring. Once these old o-rings are moved from their original position, there's more than an even chance they won't re-seal. I had exactly this issue when I first fitted the FOC. Everything back together after I'd 'checked' inside the filter, which takes the pressure off the o-ring. It was age-hardened/set and simply wouldn't re-seal. So, back to square one - which is more or less where you seem to be. Someone recently posted an eBay link for new o-rings. Good luck
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Old 6th December 2021, 16:15   #14
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Bit of an update for anyone interested. Had the RAC out with the simple goal of getting towed to the specialist garage I use. They guy that arrived was very knowledgeable and enthusiastic and wanted to check a few things so I was happy to let him.

We ended up checking the timing, the compression, the coils and plugs, the pump functionality and he read through fault codes and all that is left is the filter assembly which I know has been suggested by you fine people and is what I was thinking it was too.

When he went to take a look after i had told him I'd already had it out and I wouldn't hold him responsible for any damage the actual filter housing came apart in his hands so I suspect now that I've had it out the bayonette is free and loose.

I've now ordered the white clip that is now available along with a new oring as suggested so I'm hoping that will solve it. If it isn't that then I am truly out of options for what I'm prepared to do in the current tempritures and weather, fingers crossed.

Shaun

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Old 9th December 2021, 16:14   #15
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Hi all.

New filter oring and filter housing clip are on. I can feel the system pressurising through the fuel filter outlet pipe (or I think I can). Still no start.

Question is on the 1.8t would I have the problem of having to add more fuel to the pump side? When the RAC were out the other day £15 was added to that side and whilst we did turn the car over a lot when they were looking would the pump move that much petrol to the filter side?

Anyway if this isn't the problem is appreciate where next to look?

I've been looking at a new car to turn this into a full hobby project instead of it being a rolling project.....please save me from myself hahahaha.

Shaun

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Old 10th December 2021, 00:00   #16
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Question is on the 1.8t would I have the problem of having to add more fuel to the pump side?
If the level was already quite low, then it's easily done. So yes, after the clip's fitted you should add more to be sure.

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When the RAC were out the other day £15 was added to that side and whilst we did turn the car over a lot when they were looking would the pump move that much petrol to the filter side?
I'd be surprised if the pump running during a 'small' number of restart attempts would have transfered £15 of fuel, even with the filter case completely separated. But at today's prices, who knows! After fitting the clip, another gallon would eliminate that possibility so maybe worth it? Are you confident that the new cap seal was fitted properly? I've seen one or two located in the wrong place.

EDIT: I've lost track - did you check/swap the cam sensor?

TC

Last edited by T-Cut; 10th December 2021 at 00:03..
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Old 12th December 2021, 16:38   #17
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If the level was already quite low, then it's easily done. So yes, after the clip's fitted you should add more to be sure.

I'd be surprised if the pump running during a 'small' number of restart attempts would have transfered £15 of fuel, even with the filter case completely separated. But at today's prices, who knows! After fitting the clip, another gallon would eliminate that possibility so maybe worth it? Are you confident that the new cap seal was fitted properly? I've seen one or two located in the wrong place.

EDIT: I've lost track - did you check/swap the cam sensor?

TC
Thanks T-cut.

Just an update the car is running again thankfully. I undid the filter again and it appeared the oring was in position. I did notice that the float arm was unattached from the filter housing but I can't imagine that was causing the issue. The positive is it's now reattached, the oring is new and I have the clip on the filter housing so silver lining.

Final question before I call this issue closed.

I did add another 5 litres with a petrol can so the tank is over 1/4 full now so the question is could I see the issue again if the tank falls below 1/4 or is that only with the diesels?

Cheers

Shaun

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Old 12th December 2021, 17:06   #18
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... could I see the issue again if the tank falls below 1/4 or is that only with the diesels?
Only with the diesels Shaun. I think it becomes important when the in-tank "lift" pump fails but I'm open to correction by the diesel experts on that.

With the petrol engines you can let the tank run as low as you like and the pump is very reliable.

Simon
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Old 12th December 2021, 17:18   #19
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Only with the diesels Shaun. I think it becomes important when the in-tank "lift" pump fails but I'm open to correction by the diesel experts on that.



With the petrol engines you can let the tank run as low as you like and the pump is very reliable.



Simon
Cheers for the info Simon.

Fingers crossed this one is ticked off the list.

Cheers

Shaun

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