Wishbone arm ball joint keeps failing

Rick-sta · 4th April 2017, 00:43

Took my dad's 75 in for a MOT today and it failed on the nearside wishbone ball joint having excessive play. This is pretty annoying as it was replaced 6 months ago (the whole wishbone and the ball joint) and was replaced again just under a year before that. We've fitted a proper replacement both times not a cheap one as they just fail very quickly. so this is the third time it's failed in the space of about 18 months.

The driver's side has been fine the whole time.

Could there be something else wrong that could be causing the ball joint to fail so regularly?

The car isn't even used that much anymore, my dad used to do 100 miles a day for work but now he works locally in the next town and has done for over a year now, has hit very few pot holes so don't see what could be causing it

Robson Rover Repair · 4th April 2017, 03:12

Hub itself prehaps has an issue?

My ztt failed on stretched pinch bolt which looked fine on removal but comparing it against another new one was some 3/4mm longer and had a narrow in the middle, I couldnt believe it when i removed it, new xpart one two years ago at engine swap on both sides.

So changed, torque'd up (and a little more than the 40nm lol) and she passed instantly.

SCP440 · 4th April 2017, 06:59

Where are you sourcing these parts from? If the part has failed in under 12 months and has been bought from a reputable seller it will be covered under warranty.

Yes you still have the hassle of replacing the part.

I was given some supposedly genuine parts to fit to a car by its owner, the boxed looked OK but the quality of the part inside was very dubious, there is a lot of fake stuff out there.

Jakg · 4th April 2017, 10:08

Is it play in the ball joint, or play in the hub where the ball joint goes into?

If the hub isn't clamped properly around the top of the ball joint, it can move and will open up the clamp as it wears making it worse, requiring a new hub. Had the same problem on mine. Typically caused by releasing the ball joint but then not doing the bolt up tight enough on reassembly (unfortunately "tight enough" appears to be far in excess of the official torque figure).

Cavyman130 · 4th April 2017, 10:18

not quite as excessive as yours but I found my wishbones lasted a year, suppose I do cover high miles.

chris75 · 4th April 2017, 15:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Colin_NI

Hub itself prehaps has an issue?

My ztt failed on stretched pinch bolt which looked fine on removal but comparing it against another new one was some 3/4mm longer and had a narrow in the middle, I couldnt believe it when i removed it, new xpart one two years ago at engine swap on both sides.

So changed, torque'd up (and a little more than the 40nm lol) and she passed instantly.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jakg

Is it play in the ball joint, or play in the hub where the ball joint goes into?

If the hub isn't clamped properly around the top of the ball joint, it can move and will open up the clamp as it wears making it worse, requiring a new hub. Had the same problem on mine. Typically caused by releasing the ball joint but then not doing the bolt up tight enough on reassembly (unfortunately "tight enough" appears to be far in excess of the official torque figure).

Agree with these comments

This is a very , very common problem and an old thread here refers :
http://www.the75andztclub.co.uk/foru...hub+pinch+bolt
My brother , who has many years experience on machinery maintenance , tells me that it is usual for such a clamp to relax or creep and open up more than original when released ; it will therefore require a little extra torque to restore original clamping when reassembled .

EastPete · 4th April 2017, 15:58

I tighten the pinch bolts to 65Nm rather than the book value of 45 Nm to make sure the joint does not open up - I also place a scissor jack under the lower arm outer joint when replacing/tightening the pinch bolt, to make sure the ball joint 'pin' is pushed fully up into the pinch joint in the hub.

I have bought new pinch bolts from Rimmers in the past, but these often come absolutely plastered in threadlock, such that it is a struggle to get the nut on, down the threads and torqued up correctly. Even the new ones have a slight narrowing in the middle of the unthreaded section (presumably to allow space for the ball joint pin to pass through the pinch joint).

Pete

RogerHeinz57 · 4th April 2017, 23:46

The pinch bolt needs to be checked for wear after various monkies have over tightened it over the years, yes going tighter may well exert a greater force on the clamped area, but this will compromise the bolt diameter where it matters the most. The cost of replacing the nut/bolt is small fry against the stupidity of over tightening the fixing, narrowing the machined surface the ball joint relies on and ruining the whole arm assy in the process. An expensive process if you think about it properly.

4th April 2017, 00:43	#1
Rick-sta This is my second home MG ZT 2.0 CDTI+ in Typhoon, MG TF 135 in Typhoon & Rover 75 Connoisseur CDTI SE in Pearl Black Join Date: Oct 2012 Location: Norfolk Posts: 7,532 Thanks: 2,718 Thanked 2,827 Times in 1,462 Posts	Wishbone arm ball joint keeps failing Took my dad's 75 in for a MOT today and it failed on the nearside wishbone ball joint having excessive play. This is pretty annoying as it was replaced 6 months ago (the whole wishbone and the ball joint) and was replaced again just under a year before that. We've fitted a proper replacement both times not a cheap one as they just fail very quickly. so this is the third time it's failed in the space of about 18 months. The driver's side has been fine the whole time. Could there be something else wrong that could be causing the ball joint to fail so regularly? The car isn't even used that much anymore, my dad used to do 100 miles a day for work but now he works locally in the next town and has done for over a year now, has hit very few pot holes so don't see what could be causing it __________________ How to retrofit Cruise Control on a diesel with no OEM wiring in place: Link How to retrofit heated electric memory seats with no OEM wiring in place: Link How to operate FBH and ATC via text Link How to restore cloudy projector headlights Link

4th April 2017, 03:12	#2
Robson Rover Repair NI/ROI RS ZT-T 190 / 75 Diesel x3 / 6 door limo / 216 Cabby / Rover 25 van Join Date: May 2009 Location: Antrim Posts: 8,101 Thanks: 299 Thanked 1,046 Times in 568 Posts	Hub itself prehaps has an issue? My ztt failed on stretched pinch bolt which looked fine on removal but comparing it against another new one was some 3/4mm longer and had a narrow in the middle, I couldnt believe it when i removed it, new xpart one two years ago at engine swap on both sides. So changed, torque'd up (and a little more than the 40nm lol) and she passed instantly. __________________ Cheers, Colin Robson Rover Repair on Youtube DISCOUNTED MTEC BRAKES FOR ALL MG ROVER'S Braided hoses, more coating and pad options for 2024

4th April 2017, 06:59	#3
SCP440 I really should get out more....... MG ZT-T 260 Join Date: Feb 2016 Location: Witney Posts: 2,504 Thanks: 6 Thanked 910 Times in 571 Posts	Where are you sourcing these parts from? If the part has failed in under 12 months and has been bought from a reputable seller it will be covered under warranty. Yes you still have the hassle of replacing the part. I was given some supposedly genuine parts to fit to a car by its owner, the boxed looked OK but the quality of the part inside was very dubious, there is a lot of fake stuff out there.

4th April 2017, 10:08	#4
Jakg This is my second home N/A Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Suffolk Posts: 6,867 Thanks: 0 Thanked 397 Times in 302 Posts	Is it play in the ball joint, or play in the hub where the ball joint goes into? If the hub isn't clamped properly around the top of the ball joint, it can move and will open up the clamp as it wears making it worse, requiring a new hub. Had the same problem on mine. Typically caused by releasing the ball joint but then not doing the bolt up tight enough on reassembly (unfortunately "tight enough" appears to be far in excess of the official torque figure).

4th April 2017, 10:18	#5
Cavyman130 Avid contributor MG ZT-T Join Date: Feb 2013 Location: Cramlington Posts: 218 Thanks: 7 Thanked 34 Times in 20 Posts	not quite as excessive as yours but I found my wishbones lasted a year, suppose I do cover high miles.

4th April 2017, 15:58	#7
EastPete Posted a thing or two Rover 75 CDTi Classic saloon, MGB GT, Skoda Yeti Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Ramsey, Cambs Posts: 1,874 Thanks: 626 Thanked 635 Times in 430 Posts	I tighten the pinch bolts to 65Nm rather than the book value of 45 Nm to make sure the joint does not open up - I also place a scissor jack under the lower arm outer joint when replacing/tightening the pinch bolt, to make sure the ball joint 'pin' is pushed fully up into the pinch joint in the hub. I have bought new pinch bolts from Rimmers in the past, but these often come absolutely plastered in threadlock, such that it is a struggle to get the nut on, down the threads and torqued up correctly. Even the new ones have a slight narrowing in the middle of the unthreaded section (presumably to allow space for the ball joint pin to pass through the pinch joint). Pete

4th April 2017, 23:46	#8
RogerHeinz57 I really should get out more....... A Reasonably Priced Car Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Burton Latimer Posts: 2,530 Thanks: 408 Thanked 1,064 Times in 712 Posts	The pinch bolt needs to be checked for wear after various monkies have over tightened it over the years, yes going tighter may well exert a greater force on the clamped area, but this will compromise the bolt diameter where it matters the most. The cost of replacing the nut/bolt is small fry against the stupidity of over tightening the fixing, narrowing the machined surface the ball joint relies on and ruining the whole arm assy in the process. An expensive process if you think about it properly.