Cheap cam belt change for v6

[trikey]

I have no idea!

[Les4048]

Only thing I can think of the belt drives a water pump on one version but not the other. Not knowing these engines I’m trying to think out of the box for a reason the belts would be under a different operating conditions

[marinabrian]

Originally Posted by Les4048

Only thing I can think of the belt drives a water pump on one version but not the other. Not knowing these engines I’m trying to think out of the box for a reason the belts would be under a different operating conditions

No, the water pump is driven by the belt in both cases Les

[trikey]

Different tensioner?

[Moonshine Mark]

Change of belt from 23mm to 26mm width?

[Borg Warner]

Originally Posted by marinabrian

Right, try this for size

1999 Rover 200 103 PS 1400 16v cambelt interval 45,000 miles/five years

2000 Rover 25 103 PS 1400 16v cambelt interval 60,000 miles six years

So here we have two cars, identical power output, engine displacement, and both the same physical size.

Now tell me why the intervals are different between the two cars, I know why but do you

Trust me there is a valid point to this.

Brian

As there are quite a few who do not know the answer I'll ask why the difference then?

[marinabrian]

Originally Posted by trikey

Different tensioner?

Yes

Originally Posted by Moonshine Mark

Change of belt from 23mm to 26mm width?

And yes

I quoted this as a pertinent example of why there may be differences between two seemingly identical engines, and why the manufacturer specified different belt change intervals.

It is not a bean counting issue as some may suggest, there are engineering design differences behind what could be described as the manufacturers ongoing development.

Brian

[sworks]

The introduction of the auto tensioner, whenever you were given a new belt in 2000 you had to check it was the correct one Also worth noting there was a similar timing belt change interval on the L series diesels, different times depending on chassis number

[mgzrjake]

Re miles that can be travelled, my father in law gave his 2000 75 V6 190 to our local college for use by up and coming budding mechanics. He gave it away due to a catastrophic mot fail.

Now re miles accomplished he was the second owner it had 159k on her and had never had a belt change, he purchased it with 46k in 2004 and it was never a question I asked till we delivered it to the college I just assumed he had had it done ! He replied didn’t think I needed to why is it important but then he’s 84 and it was his last car due to failing eye sight. So maybe pure luck or the fact he never put his foot down hard and the ipk was always showing 31 mpg a figure he was quite proud of.

Just my feedback back on this subject and I’m not stating go with this, just making a point.

[clf]

Originally Posted by SD1too

Originally Posted by clf
I most definitely have experienced air ... filter failure! They get blocked up ...

They don’t get blocked up if the engine isn’t running Alan, simply due to the passage of time! I agree that air filters should be renewed after assessing the degree of contamination.

if the engine isnt running , there will be no need to change it. (I know you mean when the car is laid up lol) . However, they do become blocked up even when the engine isnt running! The air ducting by its very design is NOT air tight, so whilst it will be minimal, air and its dust (flies and creepy crawlies etc) will still get to enter the air filter housing. And depending on the climate, there is also a chance of mould too! Granted if left unused for a long period of time, it is not going to get seriously blocked (in our climate) - however you would then be advised to change the belts and pulleys amongst other things but that's another argument ........ oh wait lol I know this isnt strictly about filters but you did bring it up - if it was mine, and I have done this in the past, if it is relatively clean, I would have rotated it after giving it a good dusting out and shake, replacing when it becomes necessary - the ZT does get a new one every year and checked every few months but previous cars got them when they needed. Another aspect of the air filter is the rubber sealing areas. These WILL dry out over a period of time and shrink allowing unfiltered air by - ok that is going to be a very rare occurrence, but it does happen

Originally Posted by clf .. if a car is driven gently by the 90 year old vicar ... cambelt could last easily 200,00. However, a ZT manual and driven by a 29 year old ... boy racer, driven hard, could last 100,000, before the hard starts and hard acceleration start to take their toll.

That theory has been put forward before but it doesn’t stand up to examination (what or whose examination? the only examination I would hold weight to, would be a scientific dissection of each under lab conditions)
1. Neither belt nor car manufacturers take driving style into account when specifying time periods for cambelt renewal. They HAVE to, no designer would not consider the variance of potential customer their products would be sold to. That is why there is so much compromise in design (not just of belts) Even as a layman, you cannot deny that hard starts and hard driving does not negatively affect the belts or other moving components for that matter
2. My belts were in service for three times the specified time period without a problem. The effects of that probably exceed, or at least equal, the treatment given by your example boy racer in a third of the time (and less mileage than 90,000). How do you know this? Do not forget also, the margin of error that every designer designs into a product
3. We don’t hear about belt breakages in KV6s owned by boy racers. We don’t hear about any at all (except Brian’s solitary example). hmmm I am sure I have read about more than one or two over the past four years on the forum - but I cannot recall any details involving the reasons behind these. I may be wrong of course


Originally Posted by clf In terms of materials, to cover the 6 year timescale, you cannot expect the materials to have the same properties and longevity if comparing between use in the arctic circle, europe and middle east ...
MG Rover’s schedule is the same whether the car is sold in the UK, Europe or the Middle East so I’m afraid that argument doesn’t ring true either. Sorry.

I havent seen any service schedules for middle east or arctic , not sure I would be able to read them anyway lol. However my thoughts were based and borne from the service schedule in my old carina, which was sold in the middle east and arctic circle , and the schedules and oil specs differed, I cannot recall the timing belt, but the ancillary belts(more conspiracy! lol) were something like 2/3s of the distance, and air and oil filters for the middle east were even less! (I know this was not an MGR, but the principle remains)

Thanks for your polite and coherent points though Alan.


Simon

I am not trying to be argumentative, it is your car and your choices, I do not think nor believe that cars will suddenly explode once past their scheduled service times. But instead of thinking that manufacturers are in it purely for the money, think of it as I mentioned numerous times as a reputation protection. If they lost their reputation, they will lose custom, they will lose sales, they will lose the company - if you mention to someone with a passing interest in cars the brand Rover, head gasket will be their first thought almost certainly, and how boring their second?

Whilst I dont know, I theorize that the schedules more likely to be half of what they really could be, but have to base their expectations on a worse case scenario of an average (it HAS to be an average, as noone can say how each individual product will be used by each individual - yours will be different to mine etc)

It has been mentioned previously, but tyres are a perfect comparison to the belts. Would you keep or trust the 10 year old 500 miles every year, on your caravan/trailer etc that remain air tight and fitted permanently? My mother's Clio last year had all 4, 6 year old 5mm tyres, with 9,000 miles replaced due to cracking on the sidewalls - I know they are safety dependent but then the belts are in a way too, the safety of your engine.

Surely you, nor anyone else cannot deny they have been given based on some kind of scientific research and development? Somewhere else it was mentioned, that different manufacturers have different schedules for their belts, design and application would explain this

I hope this displays correctly and legibly, I was trying to retain the context of my reply.